The Pen Addict 448/transcript

The Pen Addict Podcast Transcript
Episode:	448
Title:	The Hurley School of Pen Usage
Release Date:	February 10th, 2021
Hosts:	Brad Dowdy Myke Hurley
Guests:	Adina Hurley
Additional Information
Official page:	Episode 448
Audio File:	Audio Episode 448
Podcast page:	The Pen Addict 448
Length:	8989 min <br />1.483 h <br /> minutes
Previous Transcript	Next Transcript

Pen Addict Podcast

Myke Hurley: From RelayFM, this is The Pen Addict, episode 448. Today's show is brought to you by ExpressVPN, Pen Chalet, and Harry's. My name is Myke Hurley, and I'm joined by Brad Dowdy. Hi, Brad Dowdy.

Brad Dowdy: Hello, Myke Hurley.

Myke Hurley: Nobody cares about you, Brad, because Adina's here too. Hi, Adina. Hi, everyone.

Adina Hurley: And hi, Myke and Brad.

Guest Appearance

Myke Hurley: Everyone's favourite guest has returned. Adina is back on the show. You can stop writing the letter campaigns. The petitions can end. Adina is back.

Brad Dowdy: I don't know if she thinks we're joking about that. We are not joking about that. I'm sure you probably tell her, and she probably just blows you off. Right, Adina? You really have fans on here.

Adina Hurley: Oh, I'm pleased to hear that. I do get some people asking me to come on the show, and I always say that, you know what, you should go to Myke and Brad. It's not my show.

Myke Hurley: It's not really your decision. Yeah, it's not really my decision. I'm just like on a Wednesday I'm recording, she's bursting. My time! Get out of the way!

Adina Hurley: Yeah, it doesn't quite work like that, but I'm always keen to be on. It needs to come from you.

Myke Hurley: Although, to be honest, the visual of you just coming in and pushing my wheelchair, my chair with wheels away from the desk and just taking over would be kind of hilarious. And that could happen. I could do it. Conceivably, you could do it.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, we are always in the same place together. But no, I give you your space, and we keep it professional.

Brad Dowdy: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Well, that's not a word we use very often around here is professional, and we like it that way. So, yeah, it's good to have you back. And I was looking back at the last time you were on the show. It was January a year ago, and I can't believe that. It doesn't seem that way, maybe because we talk a little bit here and there, you know, just, you know, on the side or on Instagram or something like that. But it's been over a year, and a lot has happened in the years since we've talked. So, I'm interested, and I know the listeners are interested in how have you kept up your fountain pen hobby? Because when we first had you on, you've gone from, like, ultra beginner to, like, dipping your toes in and then maybe swimming around the pool a little bit. Have you, like, really dove into the deep end now?

Pen Collection

Adina Hurley: I wouldn't say I'm quite at the deep end, but I'm definitely more advanced there than where I was the first time I came on the podcast. Like, and Myke is just counting my pens right now.

Myke Hurley: No, I'm just, like, observing what's in this, like, pen case to find my examples of deep end. Because I know that they're here, right, whether it's the two Pro Gears, the Platinum 3776, what is this one called, the Celluloid one? It's like the Cherry Blossom one.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, the Sakura one.

Myke Hurley: Got a Pen Addict Limited Edition Franklin Kristoff in here. Where's the Canalea gone? There was a Canalea here a minute ago. It's in there. It's in there? Yeah, yeah. This is the Superior Labour case that Hina uses, right? Which, that is like a three-pen case. She has one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, she has ten pens in the Superior Labour pouch. Which is honestly a thing to behold of its own. But yes, deep end, Vin sufficiently dived into.

Adina Hurley: Yes, sufficiently dived into, dove into. I think where I started, the first time I was on the show, or around there, I had four relatively cheap pens. A lot of them were children's pens as well, which is nothing wrong with that. They're perfect. They break, you buy another, great. And now, yes, I've made it to ten pens that I use all the time and rotate, keep them inked up all the time. And I have accessories, as you can see. So, I don't know, you judge that, where I am.

Brad Dowdy: I mean, I think the Superior Labour pouch has pushed you over the edge. Because I think Myke knows how I feel about that brand. And, you know, how cool I think it is. And it's like a super expensive premium brand thing. But it's just, they're just so nice. Like, I can't help myself, but like, latch on to those. But I think ten pens is pretty reasonable.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, we were gifted these from Wanda pens.

Brad Dowdy: Yes. Yeah, it's just amazing. Amazing stuff.

Adina Hurley: Sometimes I just steal things from Myke.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I mean, that's a pretty good, like, shopping location, right? Is whatever Myke has.

Myke Hurley: There's also a bunch of stuff that just isn't used all the time. So, you know, I like that Adina comes in. And unless it's something that I particularly want for a specific reason, which does also happen. But I like that she uses the things that I'm not using. Yeah. Because then these tools are actually getting the use that they deserve. You know, like an almost Toy Story-like way. They're just sitting there waiting to be played with.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I totally wish, like, my wife and kids would use more of my stuff. Like, they'll want something specific every now and then. And I'm always glad to oblige. Like, my wife will say, can I have this color pen with this color ink? I'm like, sure, and we'll do that. But I wish they would do, like, more, right? But, you know, it's sometimes slow getting into it. And you've got to work your way into it, kind of like Adina has now.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, and finding your own way into it as opposed to being pushed into it by someone else and their preferences. So it's good that you're not pushing it because it might have more chances that they will find it themselves.

Journaling Habits

Myke Hurley: I would say I strongly encouraged and then backed off a bit. And then you honestly did find your own way. Yeah. And I think the big turning point, which we spoke about last time you were on, was the San Francisco Pen Show. Yeah. That really opened up your hobby into new areas, you know, with the more expensive pens and trying to understand what's so good about them and getting to try different ink on a larger scale, which we're going to talk about later on today anyway. But I think that was what really opened you up. And I think that there's many people that have a similar story of, you know, seeing things online, buying the occasional product here or there is great. But being able to go and try these things out is awesome. And not to kill the mood too much, but that's been one of the great tragedies of the last year for our community is that we have not been able to have those experiences, whether they are pen clubs or pen shows, meetups, that kind of stuff. They've all obviously had to go by the wayside for a while and honestly probably will be for the entire 2021 as well. But Brad, do you know what? I just realized like the next time we go to a pen show could actually be Tokyo.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. It's not out of the realm of possibility. I was talking to someone late last week on the phone or this weekend or something and we were thinking about pen shows, just like what would the calendar look like? And we're just sitting here going, nope, nope, probably not. Like maybe some of the stuff in summer might hit, but would I even really want to travel? I'm not sure. Like that's still, that's reasonably close, like six months away. Right. And I'm not sure that's in my mindset of, yeah, let me hit the road and do things. So it really might be next year, which is, yeah, that's a weird thought to have. But I agree.

Myke Hurley: It's a good one to start traveling again. I mean, yeah, as far as it goes, it's pretty great. I mean, I genuinely hope that Atlanta 2022 could happen. And I'll be honest, like feels like a possibility to me now, right? Because especially like, you know, I was kind of being a little glib, but the more the point is that like, I don't think that we'll be doing this again till 2022. And as longtime listeners will know, that is when we plan to go to Tokyo because 2022 is also the 10 year anniversary of the show. So it will be, you know, that's what we're aiming for for 2022. And it's something to look forward to.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, exactly right. And just to circle back and put a bow on this whole conversation, I didn't know where we're going to get off on the pen show track, but they are very important. And seeing Adina experience like the 2019 San Francisco pen show just was exactly the same when I went to my first pen show in Atlanta. It was 2011 or 2012. Like everything changed, right? Like everything changed about what I thought about the hobby, thought about like my purchasing experience, you know, how, you know, maybe I can wait and test things out. What other things are out there that you don't get to see just on the day to day basis. And I hope we get back to pen shows again soon. I'm going to I want to talk about like your specific stuff like pens and inks and like how you're using things. But I wanted mostly to know just in general over since the last time we've talked really like we've been in a quarantine. There's been a global pandemic. You've been on lockdown in certain various forms over, you know, the past year. Did you find yourself writing more during the pandemic? Did you find yourself nothing changed? Did you find yourself writing less? I was just curious how people use like their stationary goods during during this time.

Adina Hurley: I think that I've definitely written more because I've done more journaling and I've been doing it more consistently. And that's both for journaling itself and using a tracker because what I discovered about myself is that if I put these things down into a tracker and I make sure to do those every day, I think very similar to how you treat it as well. And I feel balanced and I feel OK. So for me, actually, journaling has gone up, not down like it has happened for a lot of other people. And that brought in wanting to use more pens, wanting to change the inks and keep it fresh. So I've actually used all of my pens more and written more.

Brad Dowdy: That's awesome because I could see it going the other way. Like I get in these ruts. I've definitely been writing more. I've especially been writing more probably the last three or four months than like the previous, like the middle of last year when like things were super stressful and things like that. I wasn't necessarily writing as much. But I think people I just want to make sure like people understand that it's OK not to write sometimes like when you're super stressed. But in the end, if you get into the habit of doing it, especially during challenging times, you'll start to want to do it. Then you start missing to do it. And that's where I found myself. And it sounds like you're kind of kind of the same way, right?

Adina Hurley: Yeah, I think I think what has what I've changed in order to be able to keep up with it is that I changed my prompts. And what I needed from journaling was very different from the before times. So that's what helps to keep with it. Whereas I guess that older productivity prompts or whatever that may be, sometimes couldn't be applied in the pandemic times, quarantine times. And I can see how easy it is to fall off. And I've definitely fallen off that horse as well. But I missed it. So I just tried to tweak it in a way that works better in the current context.

Myke Hurley: Where are you doing this journaling?

Myke Hurley: This isn't like a branding exercise as such.

Brad Dowdy: But I'm just sure you had a specific question about that. So answer, let's see.

Adina Hurley: I'm using a theme system.

Adina Hurley: That's why I was laughing.

Myke Hurley: How hard is it to get it out though? No, but like genuinely, because you were saying like tracking. And I wasn't sure. Because I obviously know you use the theme system. Yeah. But I was wondering if you also had something else that you were using. Or if you were referring to the daily questions part, the daily themes part.

Adina Hurley: The tracking part is part of the theme system. And that's what I use. I also use an app on my phone, which is sort of related to journaling. And as I was saying, I'm just doing it because that's what I needed then. And it's mostly as a way to keep up with what I'm doing every day. I feel like because of this repetitiveness, I'm sometimes... I can't remember what I was doing a few hours ago or this morning and all of that. And I honestly have an app where I write as much as I remember what I've done in that day. And that's a different kind of journaling, I guess. But mostly I do it on paper. And it's mostly a reflective exercise and a tracking thing to make sure I stay balanced.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. What app is it that you're using?

Adina Hurley: I'm using Grid Diary, which is one of these journaling or diary apps where you set your own prompts. And it's kind of this... Yeah. I like choosing my own prompts and changing them according to what I need. And obviously there was a very 2020 problem to have.

Brad Dowdy: I like how you put that. Do your prompts overlap? We're going to go way off tangent a lot this episode because I haven't got to talk to Adina. And I'm very curious about how people use things. So I want to know, do your prompts overlap between your analog and digital tools or are they separate?

Adina Hurley: No, they're separate. My analog one is mostly a tracking. Like I need to do these things in a day. And I'm sure I know that if I do these things, I'm content. And it's also a reflective exercise. Like what went well today, I suppose, or more how I feel about it. Whereas on the phone, I literally just list the activities I did that day. Because sometimes I feel like the feeling I have about a day doesn't match with what I've actually done that day. Feelings are a bit misleading like that. And the part about memory that you don't quite remember as well because of this repetitive what you've done in a day really can put pressure on that feeling, whether it's good or bad. But I guess maybe the app on my phone, I use it more to set my agenda for the day and what I want to do. And then at the end, I look back and enumerate what I've done. And it also pushes me to make sure I do what I set out for me, for myself to do in a day. It's like when I start listing, it's like, okay, I've been messaging with friends, but I know that I've set out to do this thing. And it makes me question, why am I wasting time? Why am I not doing the thing I wanted to do? So I guess it's more for productivity purposes, the phone part.

Brad Dowdy: So now I have more thoughts. Oh, no. Because, no, because I'm listening to you say this, and I see a protection system here to where you have two separate systems that work together, right? You kind of start your day digitally, you end your day in the analog. And if someone's, let's say someone's bullet journaling just for ease of use, and they're doing everything in there, if they miss a day or they miss part of the time, that starts to compound in the one thing that you're using, where you have this safety net of, well, I do this part of the thing in digital, and it's mostly in the morning. Then I do this other part of my life and my exploration and my habit tracking analog in the afternoon. It almost sets you up for success a little more. I'm way overthinking this, but that's what I hear when I hear you talking about this.

Adina Hurley: And now that you're explaining it like that or going over it like that, I do remember that you're a fan of multiple systems that work together as well, right? Right. Yeah, I think with all of my systems that I've had to tweak them throughout the months and wherever I was in the year and what I needed to do, I still feel like I've had a fairly productive last year, I guess. And I feel content about it, but there was also a lot of work with all of these systems that I have to make sure I take stock of what's going well, not just dwelling on the bad stuff, but also to make sure I'm doing things that make me feel good about my skills and all, you know?

Theme System

Brad Dowdy: Yep. Yep. That's awesome. Oh, man. I, I, all right. I'm going to ask one more question about the theme system journal and then we can, then we can talk about stuff. And like, I want to know if you feel like, you know, made any purchases and like what you're getting into these days. So I always have to, when I find people that use a theme system journal, I need to know how they do, what are the, what are the circles called? Myke, I can never get the right name. Well, it's difficult. The habit tracker. Because there's an official name.

Myke Hurley: So I call them daily themes. Okay. But I also use habit tracking interchangeably because that's just become a phrase that people understand. But I call them daily themes because it's things you want to focus on every day, but it's just as easy to call them habit trackers. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So in the habit trackers, Adina, do you use the same pen that you've written in your daily log? Yes. And then like, and then does the pen color change? Like, will you use, okay, Tuesday's pen that I wrote in the journal, that's the pen that gets, or pencil, whatever it could be. That's what gets in the, the habit, fills out the habit trackers, and then tomorrow it's different, or do you have like a singular habit tracking pen or pencil?

Adina Hurley: So every day I choose two pens that work together, and I write the prompts, the date with one, and I write the longer text with the other one. So I would use either one of those in the tracking system as well. And then the next day I change it, I choose other two. So that's how I go through my whole collection.

Myke Hurley: That's such a great idea. Where could you have, man, that's some visionary must have come up with that method. I'm telling you, like, that's really, that's really great.

Adina Hurley: Yep. I came up with it myself. Yeah. Yeah.

Myke Hurley: There you go. That's how that one worked out.

Brad Dowdy: So, yeah. So that says, I see, I just got to know, like, these are the, this is why I got to know these things. This is why we got to see each other and be able to, like, you know, check out these journals in person and I can ask you all the stupid questions.

Myke Hurley: I ain't laying you anywhere near my journal.

Brad Dowdy: You can show me the habit tracker page. Okay. Like, I share my habit tracker page. I don't share the contents of the journal pages.

Myke Hurley: All right. Should we take our first break? Let's do it. This episode is brought to you by our friends over at Pen Chalet. They sell authentic, amazing rollerballs and fountain pens, ballpoints and mechanical pencils from all of your favorite brands. They're always adding new products. Every single month, you're going to find new stuff added to Pen Chalet. Whatever you want, they have got it. And they do great discounts every month, multiple times a month. They have closeout specials. They have special discounts that they run. And, of course, you get your hands on even more special exclusive deals because you listen to this show. As well as pens and pencils, they also carry the accoutrement that you may need for your pen stationary habit. Stuff like refills, paper, fountain pen converters, carrying cases, and so much more. Pen Chalet ship internationally and they have great shipping rates. And if you're in the U.S. and you spend over $50, shipping is free. They also offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee at Pen Chalet. They want you to be happy with the products that you get from them. So, go to penchalet.com. That's P-E-N-C-H-A-L-E-T.com. And click the podcast link at the top of the website. Use the password penaddict for this week's special offer. And you will be able to see a bunch of wonderful products that Brad's going to talk about. But also, get the code that you need to save 10% on anything at any time over at Pen Chalet. What is grabbing your attention this week, Red Dowdy?

Brad Dowdy: Well, I want to talk about the anything at any time option because they have the TWSBI Eco in smoke rose gold. That one's going to be a hot item this early 2021. It's pretty pricey in relation to the Eco, right? These are all things you got to relate them to themselves. So, this is like a $50 Eco instead of a $25 or $30 Eco. But it's like the rose gold and smoke gray that they do such a good job with. I think it's a really, really good look. They also have exclusive Robert Oster inks to, I guess, you know, match the area where Pen Chalet is in in Arizona. Antelope Canyon, Monsoon Sky, Seguro Green, Sedona Red. So, they're very Arizona heavy inks. And, Myke, I bought my first Tibaldi from Pen Chalet using the code penaddict at checkout. And I bought the Perfecta, which is not the model I went in to buy. But I ended up purchasing it after I looked through the different models. And this one stuck out to me. It has a tortoise beige cap on it. So, I have been buying some Pen Chalet goods.

Myke Hurley: This is an interesting looking pen.

Brad Dowdy: That's why I purchased that one as opposed to some of the other Tibaldis. So, which look great. But, you know, they're pretty standard. You know, traditional acrylics and, you know, just classically styled. And this one is too, but it's a different kind of setup, which we'll talk about that later. You know, maybe in a month or so once I get time to play with it. But back over to the listeners page. These Conklin walnut pens, I've been seeing these pop up everywhere. They're a really good price. They're really pretty. It's not what I expected from Conklin, to be perfectly honest. And I kind of like them. And the price that they're at.

Myke Hurley: There's a gift pen right there.

Brad Dowdy: Especially at the price. The price is ridiculous. Like, you got to go check that out. And if you scroll a little bit, they have the Montegrappa Fortuna, which is a personal favorite of mine. Really good shape barrel. Really good pen. And then one of these days, Myke, and we'll wrap it up on this. Ron is going to get me with these Pelican rollerballs and ballpoints. Now, I don't, like, this is not a product I would spend, like, full freight on, right? It's just not something I'm going to use. But they have the Suveron R405 Stressmon, which is the black, gray stripe, silver trim, which was a really popular fountain pen model. The rollerball model. At a price that always makes me, like, think I should, that's the price that I need to test this pen out at. And it just kind of looks cool. I kind of want to do that and just feel the difference there on what it's going to be like to, like, say, like a traditional, another rollerball pen. Because, you know, the higher-end rollerballs is not something that gets a lot of play. But I think these companies must sell a lot of them because they are always coming out with new ones.

Myke Hurley: If you want to go and find these deals for yourself, go to penshelly.com. Click the podcast link at the top of the website. Use the password to pen addict to see the special offers and also get the code that you need to save 10% on anything at any time. At Pen Chalet. Our thanks to Pen Chalet for their continued support of this show and RelayFM.

Brad Dowdy: All right, Adina. Yeah. What are your latest pickups during, you know, maybe the last... God, I hate that it's been over a year, so I have to cover a year worth of topics since I haven't talked to you in so long. But what new stuff have you bought pens-wise, you know, that you've found to be really awesome, you know, ink-wise, paper-wise? What are you really, really liking these days?

Adina Hurley: Well, so recently I've started making comics. And a lot of my purchases have come more from that hobby and they're more geared towards that hobby. But in fountains, fountain pens as well, I guess that the last pen I bought was the Platinum Curidas, which I can't even remember now whether it was 2020 or 2019.

Myke Hurley: I think it was at the beginning.

Brad Dowdy: It would have been the beginning. It would have been February. Right. Because that's when y'all went to that event at Choosing Keeping because y'all got them before we in the U.S. got them. So, yeah.

Adina Hurley: That was the latest edition, I suppose, a year ago and I'm still using it. I know that some people must have had some problems, but I'm still using it. I'm just seeing it as a pen in which I can put another ink. Yeah. Because I've been using my pens more, I quite like changing my ink lineup with every season or so. And that's what's pushed me to buy more inks. And recently I think we've purchased between the two of us about 10 or 11 Sailor Ink Studios. Yeah. I think Myke mentioned it on an episode.

Fountain Pens

Adina Hurley: And whenever I have more ink, then I need more pens and I go raiding from Myke's drawer. And one that I've added recently and I really liked was the Dowdy special. I have the Franklin Kristoff, the pen addict, inked with the pen addict ink, the fire on fire. Nice. I don't know what nib it has because I stole it. I didn't really, I don't really know. But it's, I really like that one. So these would be the...

Myke Hurley: 1.1 stuff.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, the stuff. I really like it.

Adina Hurley: So those would be the two new pens in fountain pens. And in inks, it's, yes, it's a Sailor Studio range that's finally become available here in the UK as well and in London.

Adina Hurley: And they're just so special and so beautiful. But I think when the shop ordered the range, they kind of, they probably thought it wasn't going to be that popular. And all of the popular shades were out of stock already by the time I got there. So I'm definitely going to buy some more from their range. So those are in fountain inks, that would be it. Oh, and you asked about paper as well.

Adina Hurley: I've, I, Myke got me for Christmas a Zoom Keen weekly planner. Gosh, another system to add to my existing one. But that's mostly just to have tasks. And it's the stuff that make sure I do every day. And Zoom Keen planners are just beautiful.

Brad Dowdy: It's totally one of my favorites. And I love the paper in them too. Not just the design is awesome and how they build them is awesome. Like you can tell, like they do a really, really good job. And then on top of it, the paper is really cool. I love, love those. Those are my favorites. So you have your, your 10 pins jammed into, to your, your superior labor, which is, you know, I'm, I'm cringing a little bit, not too, too much. It's unbelievably stretched.

Myke Hurley: I can't fully zip it up. It doesn't zip up anymore, but nevertheless, this thing, it's almost like a windsock now.

Brad Dowdy: So are all those pins inked up?

Adina Hurley: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: She's like, yeah. So this is another like early school of pen usage. It's only, it's only 10. You'll get up to like 30. That's a different conversation.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. Yeah. 10. I actually get to work my way through them. But you know, I, one of them used to be inked with the neon ink that you guys were recommending on the show.

Brad Dowdy: Is that a collar? Yeah. Collar. Yeah.

Adina Hurley: And I had the orange one in one of them, which I absolutely loved, but oh my God, what a pain it is to manage. I had the, I had the reminder every two weeks to clean it, but even in those two weeks it could dry up. So I've, when I got all of these Sailor Ink Studio inks, I just, I abandoned, I gave up on the neon. It's too much work. And whenever I would pick it up to write with it, it was already dried up. So yeah. But that, that was a fun experience as well.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. And I mean, it was good to learn like, Hey, this ink is different and I have to treat it as such, even though like it can be a pain in the butt and then therefore maybe I won't use it as much anymore. So when you're picking out the new colors, are you, will you care mostly about the ink color you're going to use or if it matches the pen? Like, is there, do you have to have that perfect pen and ink combination? And you're like, I love this ink. Let's just put it in this pen and let's go. Yeah.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. I like when it matches a bit with the pen barrel and it's within the same range. Cause it's kind of like a good sign for what sort of ink it's inside as well. Like not having to remember all of that. I put yellow in the, I don't know, black pen or whatever. So yeah, I try to match them as much as I can.

Sailor Inks

Brad Dowdy: So what are your favorites out of this new Sailor batch that you bought? So you bought, I think you, what'd you say you bought like 10 inks, 10 Sailor Ink Studio inks and they're hard to discuss because they're numbers, right? So we say, Oh, I love a 427. And you're like, cool. What color is that? So, but what are some of your favorites and like, what colors are they and why do you like them?

Adina Hurley: Well, I couldn't get some of the popular ones, which I would really love to try one day. And definitely this range would benefit from like a San Francisco Pen Show testing station and Ink's testing station.

Myke Hurley: They did have them.

Adina Hurley: Really? Yeah. Yeah.

Myke Hurley: It's the only place I've ever seen them. Oh, I must not have gotten to that one. No, we looked at them, but I don't think that you got it at that point in that sense. Like we, I remember going there, there was a stand where they had, there was like a bunch of them. I don't remember which table it was on. They didn't have all of them, but they had a lot of them. Uh, cause I had somebody explain to me kind of where these inks come from. And so they did have them.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. They, they were at the show, but someone was selling them and they had like a swatch book and you could just, based on that, you could buy the bottle, but you know how they had the testing stations. Oh, I absolutely love those. I just spent an hour on those. Uh, because with this one, what you see is not what you get sometimes or the swatch. Differs so much from the drawing, from the actual writing. But, um, my favorite out of the 10 I got was a 731, which is, um, um, an ink that's very, um, dynamic. I would say in that when you write with it, it kind of looks that the pink transitions into red and back into pink like that. And it has a golden shimmer and it's very punchy in your face. I absolutely love that one. Um, and I also, I guess another one that I like, I'm getting my little swatch book. I've, uh, used Anna's coloring to, uh, swatch them. It was my first swatching experience. I'm very proud of, uh, myself. Nice.

Brad Dowdy: That's so perfect.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. Um, another, and I, I don't know, there's lots I like. Another one is 431, uh, which is a very punchy pink. It's very in your face. Um.

Myke Hurley: It's very Califolio Andronople. Oh. It's, it's like a different kind of shade to that. It's slightly lighter, but it has a lot of the same feeling when you use it, I think.

Adina Hurley: Califolio is, that's one that both of us always fight over that bottle and we need to replace it soon. It cannot be replaced. It's so beautiful. Yeah. Um. Maybe 437 as well, which is like a moody purple. Uh, oh no, that's a 452. Uh, I, I kind of like it.

Brad Dowdy: It cracks, it cracks me up. I just love it. No, it's the best.

Adina Hurley: It's very difficult to talk about it. But my, my, uh, the colors that I got were muted, more neutral, more moody. Uh, that was one set and another set was more punchier or interesting that moved from one color to another in one writing in one motion, I guess. Uh, whereas Myke got colors that were very summery, pings and blues and yellows, and that's his style. So we have quite a variety in the 10 that we did get, but they're all very special. I think I'm so pleased we were able to get our hands on some.

Brad Dowdy: Um, yeah, and I know you'll be back for like the, the one, two threes of the world because you know, that's you, you like look at the chart, like Myke posted, like the chart will link to the sailor chart in discord. Um, just their digital chart. And it's not representative. Like it's, it's a, it's a ballpark area, but like, if you look at one, two, three, no one would ever buy that based on like sailors digital chart. Then you see it in person. It's like, this is the weirdest thing I've ever seen. Give me it.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. And it's like, similarly, as I said, and this is something that we were going through together, like, cause I'd been here before with swatching too, of like taking a cotton bud and dipping it in and then wiping that on the page is, is one thing, but it's good. The colors are going to change depending on the, the pen and the nib. Oh, massively. The nib, right. And, you know, it's like some, some of them that we were using and was realizing the sheen in, in some of these inks that, that you don't even really see from swatching. It's, it's, you see it from the, from the nibs. I just wanted to say my favorites of the ones that we got was 770, which is an incredible yellow. Um, 431, which is the really bright, vibrant pink and 141, which is a beautiful sky blue. Um, so I haven't, uh, I haven't gotten around to put in any of these inks in my pens yet, but it's something I'm going to be doing in the next week or so is picking a couple of candidates to swap out the inks from my typical rotation.

Brad Dowdy: Nice. Yeah, that'll be good. I want to see that, that yellow in action. And I definitely want to see 431, that one that you were mentioning to Dina that I, cause I like the pink, I like the pink shade. So, um, yeah, I'll look at these. I need to get some more. I have three or four. Um, but I ended up just there. I ended up just picking like, okay colors. Like I got a blue black that I love. I want to say it's 940, maybe 941. One of those two. Um, but, uh, the, the other ones that I got were just okay. So I want, I need to branch out into the, like the more pastel-y and interesting colors and sheening and sheening.

Myke Hurley: The, you know, anything from like zero to 200, uh, is super pastel. And I'm, I'm keen to see what some of these colors look like. Um, I don't, do we have, I mean, I know we have 141, but stuff like 130, 173, uh, they're really, that these beautiful pastel colors. And I kind of wonder how well they would show up from the color chart into, into real life. Right. Cause you don't really, I don't really feel like, feel like I see, uh, many inks in pastel.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. That's what Sailor did so well. Yeah. The studio lineup is experiment on that end of the spectrum. And it, I think it's paid off for them.

Myke Hurley: It's aesthetics. That's what the kids say these days.

Brad Dowdy: Mm-hmm.

Comic Creation

Myke Hurley: So we, we do want to talk to Adina about the, her comic creation. Um. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: I got, I have questions. Good.

Myke Hurley: But I wanted to just touch on, uh, your triumphant return to pen reviewing, Brad.

Brad Dowdy: Cause he's back. It feels so. He's back, baby. It feels so lame. It feels so lame. It's like, hey, I'm back. I'm back to reviewing. But it was, it was a super frustration point for me, honestly. Like, I didn't like how my handwriting looked. Therefore, I was not motivated to do pen reviews while my wrist was healing. Um. And so now I've, I've started to do more pen reviews. And I finally, like the, the AutoHut Design 03, I purchased and then broke my wrist like two weeks later, it seems like. Pens about on. So I was just getting the, the hang of the pen. Mm-hmm. But that just caused me to want to use the pen the whole time, you know, I was in, in a cast and in a brace and just, I would never shut up about it because I was mad that like, I kind of didn't get my review in when I was like, had my most, most pressing thoughts on this pen, Myke. And it's a cool pen. Like, um, I bought it cause it, the design, like I like the shape of this pen. And what I had seen from AutoHut previously was the most traditional German pens you can imagine, right? Like, like the stock photo image of German pen could be like an AutoHut, like kind of like Faber-Castell, right? Whereas.

Myke Hurley: And I would say that there's still some elements of that in this pen, like the grip section into the nib is very, um, standard looking.

Brad Dowdy: Yep. Yep. But this, the design elements of this pen switched over to like the Lamy style. Looks like the dialogue. Right.

Myke Hurley: I think that's what we said when we first saw it is that the cap shape looks like the Lamy

Brad Dowdy: dialogue. Is that called the dialogue three? It's the dialogue three now. And they're coming out with that new model, which, which we've talked about in the past where it's, it's very interesting, but it's like a combination between the dialogue and the CP one, which is the ultra thin, um, Lamy, uh, fountain pen. So it's a great pen. It's, I was concerned about it when I got it because it, it's heavy in the barrel. So it's a full metal, I guess it's probably like a brass underlay right over this black coating. And I was like, I picked it up. I was like, well, the weights kind of edge towards the back of the pen. So when you hold it, you feel it like up in your hand as opposed to feeling it down in the grip section. But as soon as I started writing that went away. So that's a good, uh, that's a good tip for someone, you know, testing out a pen when you pick it up and you think, oh, this feels heavy. Well, you need to write with it to figure out where that balance is. And if it's still heavy when you're writing with it, then maybe, you know, it's a problem. But I found that that weight issue that it does have went away when I was writing and it just hit like all it, all the check marks, you know, it, it checked all the boxes for me. Um, just in style, performance feel. Um, it's a little expensive. I think it's 180 us dollars. So I think that's kind of like the limit of this pen. Like if this was $225, I don't know that I would like think that was such a great idea for a purchase, right? You can get so many different things in there. And then as I was going through the review and wrapping it up, it finally hit me why I kind of fell for this pen. It's almost a spitting image of the Y studio brassing fountain pen that I love so much, which is it's one of my all time favorite pens. Yeah. When he took off, I took off the cap and set them down next to each other. I was like, well, now it makes sense.

Myke Hurley: Like if you just rolled the Y studio around enough, it would lose its faster thing. I have a question for you. We're going to, we're getting deep now. Is there a possibility that you have placed a lot of emotion into this pen?

Brad Dowdy: Um, no, no, because I place a lot of emotion in this pen because it's, it's one of those pens that falls into a category, which I'll explain, not because I got it and then couldn't use it. Right. It falls into the category of pens that stick with me because they changed my mind somewhere along the way.

Myke Hurley: Right. And the weight is maybe the biggest part. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: Right. So this is a pen that I thought I would love and then I got it and I was like, this is a mistake. Like, I don't know that I'm going to like this pen. And then it turned out I loved it. And that's what happens. Those are the products that stick with me more because like me and the product came to an agreement at some point that, Hey, this really works. And where my initial thoughts were more negative and with usage, they turned into a positive. And that's sometimes hard to get past. And when you're doing like a review and that's why I don't necessarily want to rush into any review. I'm going to give it some time because things change. It can go from a love to hate or hate to love, you know, in, you know, a couple of weeks or like, you know, a few pages of writing, like whatever that timeframe is, like the opinions change of a product. And that's why I latched onto this pen a little bit more, not because I couldn't use it for an extended period of time.

Myke Hurley: Okay.

Brad Dowdy: So there's not a lot of products that do that. Usually, you know, a lot of times when you're reviewing a product, it is what you thought it is.

Myke Hurley: Especially somebody with your experience.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So when, when I get products that changed my, changed my mind, I tend to latch onto them a little bit more. Yeah.

Myke Hurley: That's cool. I'm pleased that you liked it. Yep. I'm intrigued. I'm very intrigued. I'm still using it.

Brad Dowdy: Like I want to keep this like in the rotation. Like I enjoy it. It's different enough from everything else that I use where that Y studio was kind of filling that slot. Now, right now I'm using, I'm using this.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. It's intriguing, isn't it? Because I remember when, when we first saw this pen, we were like, oh, we never really talk about Otto Hut. I remember we had a conversation a long, long time, a long, long time ago where I bought an Otto Hut pen and hated it. This was years ago. Like when, it's like before I even met Adina kind of time. Like I remember it was like in where, in my, in my old family home, I remember having a conversation with you about it. This may have been like. Yeah. I remember that. 70 decibels days or something.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. It was like an ultra classic German design. And now they have, I don't know, you know, the story behind the brand, you know, like, did they have a change of design philosophy? Did they have a change of ownership that, you know, put this, you know, a different focus in adding. They didn't take away, I don't think from their traditional, like their ultra traditional conservative, what you see on a German business person's desk fountain pen. But now they've expanded a little bit into something interesting like this. That makes me want to try it.

Myke Hurley: Yeah.

Myke Hurley: All right. Let's take a second break and thank our friends at Harry's for their support of this show. Far too frequently, we have to make the choice between quality and fair prices. We've all been there. You end up trying to save some money, so you buy something that's not that great, but then you end up needing to buy something else because you're unhappy and you spent more money in the long run. Wouldn't it be nice if we could just get both quality and a fair price? This is what Harry's is all about. You get factory direct prices and award winning blades. No choice is necessary. For a limited time, Harry's is offering their starter set plus a free body wash for just $3 at harrys.com slash pen addict. Harry's delivers a close, comfortable shave, only $2 per refill. They believe in quality so much that they bought their own factory in Germany so that they could own every single step of the manufacturing process. The Harry's team combined a simple ergonomic design with five sharp blades. They sourced this deal from Sweden and manufactured their blades in this world-class factory that they own. This factory, this German factory, is one of the select few manufacturers in the world to have mastered the technology to create what's called a gothic arch. This is the gold standard for razor blade grinding. It sounds fancy. The gothic arch. It's like, yeah, I only shave with a gothic arch. And all of this is why Harry's stands behind the quality of their blades so much that they have a 100% money back guarantee on harrys.com. And Brad, can you tell me how the gothic arch works for you?

Harry's Razors

Brad Dowdy: It works amazingly well. So I was just placing a Harry's order two days ago, February 8th. I pulled up my order history and then I got to scrolling. I've placed 16 orders with Harry's since December 9th, 2014. I have placed, I don't know, is that 16 or 19 orders? I don't know. I made a count on wrong. But yeah, it's the gothic arch is going to get you, Myke. It's like the way to go. It's the only blades I shave with have the gothic arch in them, in their design.

Myke Hurley: Apparently, this is also known as the cathedral cut. And it refers to a blade's profile and denotes a cut-pointed arch.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. I mean, I'm clearly in. Like, I'm on team gothic arch for life. So yeah, there you go. But I also order other things from Harry's. Like, I had to, Myke, this order included a two-pack of texturizing putty, you know, for the hair. Get that brow and peak. That's your gothic arch. Yeah, that's my gothic arch. I don't know what they're talking about on the blades. But, you know, that is what I do. And then new product I'm testing out, Myke. Enhanced odor and sweat control extra strength antiperspirant. So that was new to me when I was buying the hair product. We're going to test out the antiperspirant as well. So this is a lot to take in for Adina. I have to start calling you Harry at some point. Yeah.

Adina Hurley: No, I love hearing you talking about Harry's in every episode. I feel your love just grows more and bigger and bigger.

Myke Hurley: We have great sponsors here. All right. For a limited time, Harry, there's an exclusive offer for listeners of this show. New customers can get a Harry's starter set and a free body wash for just $3 at harrys.com slash penaddict. That's over a $16 value for just $3. You'll get a five-blade razor, weighted handle, foaming shave gel, travel cover, and travel size body wash. Incredibly great deal. So act fast while supplies last. Go to harrys.com slash penaddict to redeem your offer. Our thanks to Harry's for their continued support of this show and Relay FM.

Brad Dowdy: So I feel like Adina has a Gothic Arch comic coming soon. So we need to talk. That's true. We need to talk about something that's really cool that you're doing, Adina. And I have a lot of questions. Okay. Why don't you tell the listeners about sticking out comics and what you're doing there?

Adina Hurley: Cool.

Brad Dowdy: It's elevator pitch time.

Adina Hurley: Okay. We haven't practiced this. Oh, no, I should have practiced. Yeah, this is a comic that I more seriously started doing, I think, during the first lockdown. I just needed an activity that I enjoyed and focused my mind when all of us had so much time on our hands.

Adina Hurley: And it's kind of like a diary comic. But I try to, it's not just flow of thoughts. I always try to have a punchline or tell a story. And I've been doing it for, at least publicly, I've been doing it for over half a year now. And I'm just, I'm so surprised how much I'm enjoying it and how much other people are enjoying it. And I, it's, so it seems to fit very well, as well with my skill set that I acquired from working in advertising, which is about observations about people or life or communicating with both images and words. So it just brings it all together into this one little hobby that I'm not yet great at, but I'm learning how to do it and I'm getting better every time.

Myke Hurley: I don't think it's fair to say you're not great at it.

Adina Hurley: But I always, I think that's a sign of growing and getting better at things when you look back and you can see what you could do better.

Myke Hurley: Everyone can be better.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Myke Hurley: I think you are great at it. And I'm not just saying that because I'm in love with you. I do think you're very good at it. But you, I mean, I get to see the behind the scenes of these comics being created. But your skills continue to improve, even though you are great at it already. But that's just normal. You know, this is just the way that people grow in their creative field. And also, I will say on that, you mentioned it being about like that it's a diary comic. I think that was the initial intention is that it would be a diary comic. But I think you quickly moved to something else which you're better at, which is observation. It's like observational comedy in a way is effectively what you're doing. Because these things, they come from your life. Yes, like a diary comic would. But observational comedy comes from an observation. And that typically tends to be now what you're doing. It's what you're good at, and it seems to be what your audience enjoys.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, that's a very good way to describe it, observational comedy. I should use that in my elevator pitch next time.

Myke Hurley: There you go. We're workshopping it here. Write that down, yeah.

Adina Hurley: It's just a direct evolution of what I used to do. And I used to enjoy doing in advertising. I started out as a creative where I was more communicating with images and words together. Like when you put together an advertising poster. And then I moved into a strategy, which is a lot more about research and observing human behavior. And what people do and say, but have a point of view on things. And from that, the comic is sort of like just picking the things that might be relevant now to other people. And trying to communicate my point of view on that in a funny way. And a lot of them resonate really well with people. Some might be funnier for me than for other people. But I'm always just so happy to get it out there. And I'm just so proud of myself that it's something that I've managed to do every week for, I think now, 28 weeks in a row. So that's impressive. That's amazing for me. I'm someone who, if I lose interest, I would give up on something. Or if I don't find any value in it. So I'm super proud about that.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. And they're multi-panel comics, right? If you go to, you know, sticking out comics on Instagram. We'll have the link in the show notes. They're all, you need to click through them. I mean, there might be, you might have like a header image sometimes. Or, you know, just a single panel comic. But they're made to be like multi-panel work. So how do they start? So this is a digital comic. Yes. Essentially, right? So how do they start in an analog fashion?

Adina Hurley: Yeah, yeah. Originally, I used to draw them and finalize them on paper. But I noticed pretty quickly that it didn't translate very well through scanning and putting it up. It didn't look that good or the way I wanted it to look. So I made myself learn Procreate for the finalized comic. But it still starts with a sketch. And I kind of have a sketchbook of ideas and just random drawings that I always go back to. But yeah, it still starts analog.

Myke Hurley: Because your original plan was to draw them, scan them, post them. But we learned quite quickly that the quality of the scans wasn't good enough.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. And it might have been the pen I was using on a wallpaper that was getting into spidering. Yeah.

Myke Hurley: I mean, I think scanning has a particular look to it, though, right? And unless you have something very high quality, it always has that kind of brighter than bright kind of look. Yeah. That I don't think you were really trying to get across.

Adina Hurley: No. And I'm not the best of drawers anyway.

Adina Hurley: Procreate just allows me a bit more room for editing and correcting without having to draw it all over. So that's a nice part of that.

Brad Dowdy: Plus, it allows for consistency, right? There's consistency in design through the panels. Like, you can say, hey, all of this kind of goes together. Even though I'm telling individual stories, you know, every week I do this. You can say, hey, this is all, like, this is what sticking out looks like and things like that. Yeah. So the weird Brad question that I have that I think that I overthink is, like, you know, if you're starting this in an analog fashion.

Adina Hurley: Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: And just like any of us who have a sketchbook where it just looks like, you know, we just throw everything at it, see what sticks and might actually, you know, pick out something. Does that same thing happen in an app like Procreate? Like, are there pages and pages of just, like, random sketches where you're just sitting there doodling in? Like, I guess that's my question. For someone who doesn't use a digital app for drawing or sketching yet, like I keep threatening to, do you basically have, like, an endless notebook of just hundreds of pages of random sketches in, like, an app called Procreate?

Adina Hurley: Yeah. So, no, I don't. I see, maybe I have a few sketches left over from when I was learning Procreate and I was, I'm not a good drawer. I'm not, this isn't my career and I don't have much experience. So even in that, I had to sketch and try a few things to work out how to draw my character, which is just a stick figure. But I, even to, in getting to that, there are so many decisions to make to see what I was comfortable with to see or to draw, whether to put eyes on it. So I have definitely some exploration of my character and how the comic should look like. But now that I'm actually in it and doing it every week, where I tend to sketch more is my notebook. And I have, like, weekly offloading sessions of whatever is in my mind, whatever I've observed and try to draw some sketches of how I see them. And they're very random. But then on Thursdays, let's say, I usually post on Friday. So on Thursdays, let's say, I go through the sketchbook and see, reread those and try to see if I can imagine a comic out of that, if it would work. So I constantly go back to that sketchbook. It's been so valuable. But I do prefer the analog part of it, pen and paper, and just how fast it is. Or I find it fast to just write down a thought or to sketch a little thing. And the sketches don't look great at all. They're very simplistic. But I see them as more complex in my mind. And it's with that image that I go into Procreate and I start making it and putting more time into it when it's been approved by me, you know?

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Yeah, that's the thing. I mean, like, analog is valuable in a digital creation process. Like, it just is. It's faster. It's less fidgety. Like, you get into an app like Procreate, you could be overwhelmed. But, like, once you get into it, you, like, you know, you've obviously figured out how to use it very well. But what is, so is Procreate, like, kind of everything for the final version of sticking out, right? Does that where, is that where, do you have, like, particular brushes or do you have particular, like, kind of everything set up there? Tell me about your Procreate setup, I guess, is the question.

Adina Hurley: Well, Procreate is a very intuitive app and easy to get into. I have found it a bit frustrating in trying to get the result I wanted to in my mind. Or, you know, when you pick up a pen and you put it on paper, you know what to expect. And sometimes you want a brush that kind of behaves like that one pen or that one black liner. And Procreate has become a lot more rewarding for me when I started looking at other comic artists or just illustrators who were selling brushes and buying their own textured brushes. And it's just, it feels it's a bit more of my own. Do you know the brush makers that you use?

Myke Hurley: If not, we can find them and add them to the notes afterwards. I'll find them afterwards. Because people will want to know which brush you're using, right?

Adina Hurley: I'll have to find them afterwards. A lot of the time they just get advertised to me on Instagram. Because that is something, I have my comics account and I only follow comic artists. And that's such a wonderful experience going through the feed of that account. It's just comics all the time. I get advertised in relevant things. It's none of the other stuff. But it also provides very specialized advertising, which is useful. But sometimes I would just go onto Google and write free comic book brushes. You know, it doesn't have, and even with that, like with pens you can hold in your hand and use on paper, you just have to try out loads until you find the one that behaves exactly like what you have in your mind.

Adina Hurley: So yeah, that's my recommendation for anyone. I don't think my brushes are perfect. Like, that depends on what you expect from it. Just like you would with a pen, a regular pen.

Brad Dowdy: Exactly. So last thing, maybe, on this until I come up with more questions. You mentioned, like, way back in the beginning when we were talking about fountain pens, that you're actually probably using more other types of pens. And I'm guessing it's, you know, related to just, you know, maybe your doodles and sketching. So, like, are you using, like, different types of markers? I know in the past we talked about right when the Uni, I think it was the Umot came out. I don't know if that's the right, how to pronounce that name. Like, that was a good cool marker set. Yes. Yeah, the Umot, yes. Like, are you using other markers or pencils? Or what are your non-fountain pen tools of choice these days?

Adina Hurley: Right, so I've actually looked through my arsenal last night to, because with some of them, they're like Japanese brushes and it took me a while to track them down. But for comics, my tools of choice are, in paper, Moleskine Volant, Volant, something like that, which is so random.

Myke Hurley: I'm, I'm, this is a, don't worry, I'm, I'm, we're doing our best here to try and move Adina away from this, uh, just FYI. It's, for some reason I love it.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I have zero, yeah, I have zero issue with Moleskine except for, like, fountain pens. It's just not a great experience.

Myke Hurley: Moleskine for art is great. I just feel like we haven't experienced other products. No, seriously though, like, you know, there are, this, this type of thin sketchbook is a, is a product that exists, um, from other people too. So we're trying, this is something that we kind of just hadn't looked at in a while. I think I gave you, you gave me a, the tote book, Studio Needs tote book to try out as well, because it's actually a very similar product and in, in its intention. So we're trying out some of those too.

Brad Dowdy: But hey, I'm going to give a shout out to the Moleskine sketchbook. Like, the sketch paper, the thick paper sketchbook. That's amazing. It's really good.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, their sketchbooks are really cool. Because that's, I think that's the bread and butter of the company. I think that's where they came from. It's that type of stuff. Yeah.

Adina Hurley: With, uh, this one, I think it was when I quit my, um, job, I think it was 2019, two years ago. Time is funny. Um, I was just in one of these, um, stationary shops and I picked it up. I think I started doodling. I did a few sort of comics even before last year, but they're very random. And I don't know why it just stuck with me. The format is really good. You can just, uh, rip up every page if you're not happy with it. It has a perforation throughout. It's very flexible. The cover, it's thin. And I don't know what it is about it, but I, I keep going back to it and I've just ordered six more now. Um, so that's paper. Um, in, I, I also sketch a lot with pencils and we have a lot of pencils around the house. I always grab just what's available, but in doing that randomly like that, I have discovered my love for black wing as well. And I can totally understand they're so different from any other pencil.

Adina Hurley: Um, yeah. I know you're a fan as well.

Brad Dowdy: I am totally, totally. Um, yeah, that's awesome. So, uh, see, I, I keep thinking of more questions.

Kuretake Pens

Adina Hurley: Oh, I wanted to say that the one that I absolutely love for inking in a way more recently is the Kuretake number seven. I absolutely love that one. I've been in the past few weeks and it is, I'm not going to go for my whole list of stuff, but it is opening me up towards more types of pens and brush pens and refillable pens that I wouldn't have used otherwise just by journaling. So that's a lot of fun.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So now the question is, do you keep all of these journals? Like, do you fill them up and have a stack? Do you, you know, kind of toss them, you know, in the closet and forget about them? Um, is there some kind of rest for, uh, reference to them later or do you light them on fire and they vanish, um, and you pick up a new notebook and go again?

Adina Hurley: Well, the sketchbooks, I do keep them because they're rich material. And I keep going back through them. But the theme system, I currently keep them, but I realize as I collect a lot more of them that I never go back to them. And it's kind of like the past is in the past. I don't think I would want to revisit it. So I am wondering whether at some point I'll just get rid of them.

Myke Hurley: I feel like your comic sketchbooks have more of a use though. Yeah. Because there are stuff you don't use. Yeah. And you may go back to it later on and be like, oh, now I have these other skills. I could actually see how I could take this little dual idea and make it into a comic. So like, you know, I actually think that your sketchbooks are probably more worthy of keeping than your journals.

Adina Hurley: Exactly. Sometimes I just go through random ideas and they spark a comic on the spot. So yeah, those I'm definitely holding on to them and they're good. They're valuable.

Brad Dowdy: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I went through a bunch of old notebooks last weekend and just trying to clean up some. And I just ripped out the pages that I wanted to keep and just going to chuck the rest, I guess.

Adina Hurley: Yeah. Maybe when I have enough of them and I just don't have the time to go for 10 at once anymore, maybe I will just rip whatever seems more that I could reuse in the future.

Brad Dowdy: Yep. That's a good idea. Well, that's awesome. I'm excited to see how this continues to play out. You've passed like whatever, you know, frustration hump in the beginning of like, can I do this? Will I do this? Will I stick to it? And now it's just rolling. So I love to see it and you're awesome at it.

Adina Hurley: And congratulations on it. Thank you.

Myke Hurley: So people should go to Instagram, follow sticking out comics. I've put it in the show notes as well. It's a weekly comic published pretty much every Friday. Pretty much. That includes the stick figure Idina getting herself into lots of scrapes and hijinks, I think is probably the best way.

Adina Hurley: And sometimes featuring Myke.

Myke Hurley: Sometimes featuring me, yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Adina Hurley: But yeah, I love how curious you've been about my journaling and my comics, Brad. I love that.

Brad Dowdy: Oh, I'm holding way back.

Adina Hurley: Well, next time.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So we should do an Idina version of Ask TPA, Myke, don't you think?

Myke Hurley: All right. Yeah, we've got a bunch of questions that I think we can all get involved in. Mm-hmm. Before we do that, let me thank our final sponsor of this week's episode, Nets Express PPN. Hey, how did you choose your internet service provider? The thing is, unfortunately, some people don't have that much choice because ISPs have a bunch of control in regions that they're in, and you don't really get a choice. It's like, this is the company that you use. And when you don't have that choice, you can find yourself in situations you don't like because they can use this control to take advantage of customers. They can put data caps in, prices stuff, streaming throttles, the list goes on. But ISPs can also log your activity and sell that data to other companies or advertisers. I protect my devices as ExpressVPN. I think you should too. It means that your data becomes your data. It's yours. ExpressVPN is a simple app for your computer or smartphone that encrypts your network data and tunnels it through a secure server so that your data becomes and stays your data. Just think of how much of your life is on the internet. Every site you visit, video you watch, or message that you send could be tracked. You don't want that. You don't want people to try and take advantage of you and use your information for their own purposes. You should only have that information for yourself. That's why I recommend ExpressVPN as the best way to hide your activity from your ISP or from anyone. You download the app, tap one button on your device, and you're protected. And ExpressVPN does all of this without slowing your connection down. That's why it's rated number one by CNET, Wired, and many more. I've been using ExpressVPN for years. I just had my plan renew just a couple of days ago. Big fan. I love how easy it is to connect. Whenever I need to use it, I can. I can say I'm from a different location than the one that I'm in, which can be really useful for getting around some geo-restriction stuff. Everything stays fast. You'd never know. You could turn it on and just stay connected, and you wouldn't know the difference. It's super great. So stop handing over your data to companies that want to sell it off and make it for their own purposes. Protect yourself with a VPN that I trust to keep my information private. Go to expressvpn.com slash penaddict. That's expressvpn.com slash penaddict. And you'll get three extra months free. One last time, expressvpn.com slash penaddict right now to learn more. Our thanks to ExpressVPN for the support of this show and all of RelayFM.

Myke Hurley: All right. So we will finish off today's episode with some hashtag ask TPA questions. The first one comes from JW Spangler, and they ask, from a performance standpoint, what is better in a fountain pen, an ebonite feed or a plastic feed, and why? This one's purely for you, Brad, I think. But I did want to know.

Brad Dowdy: I think the answer everyone will give is ebonite. It allows for different flow characteristics, a wetter flow, through the writing system of the pen. And I don't know the science behind that. It's out there on the internet. But the word is that ebonite manages the ink flow better. Maybe it doesn't dry out as much as plastic feeds could. So if by performance standpoint do you mean wetness and flow, you're going to get better performance from an ebonite feed. But if from a performance standpoint you mean drier and moderated, well, then it's going to be a plastic feed. It depends on what you want. But if you want a wetter, consistent flow, you'll see a lot of flex nibs have an ebonite feed because they can handle the ink flow better. But I think it's just because it holds the ink in place more consistently than a plastic feed does.

Myke Hurley: Fair enough. So it's definitely, if you have the choice, it's definitely worth thinking about.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, so there'll be pens that will offer an upgrade to an ebonite feed. And it's generally pretty reasonable. Like if you're already spending enough for a pen that offers that as an option, you know, the extra 20 or 30 bucks that it will cost. I think that I could be wrong on that price. Is there durability differences, Brad, between ebonite and plastic? I doubt it. I would trust the ebonite feed more, to be honest. That's kind of what I was asking. That vulcanized rubber. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Plastic feeds. Like I've snapped plastic feeds, you know, swapping out nibs. So, yeah, like the ebonite should be more durable. They definitely have a density to them. You can tell a visual and a feel difference with an ebonite feed. And, you know, apparently a flow, ink flow difference as well. So a lot of times they're worth the upgrade for people who are going to be like a heavy user of a particular pen. You probably want to upgrade if that's an option.

Myke Hurley: All right. Jessica Blue asks, and Adina, you can answer this first. Do you all rotate between the pens in your collection? Or do you have a few that you're currently using and the rest are in storage? I feel guilty about the ones that aren't being used.

Adina Hurley: Well, I only have 10. So I find it quite manageable to rotate through them and push myself to use them all. I don't know how many you have. I would totally feel guilty as well if I had too many to realistically rotate through. But then, Brad, you have a good system, I think, right?

Brad Dowdy: Well, I don't know. I'm at the feeling guilty for not being able to use all the pens I have standpoint. So it's time to sell some. So I just try not to over ink my fountain pens. Once I start to get up close to like 10 fountain pens inked, like that's the maximum. And I start to like have a little panic attack. I can't use all these how they should be used. So I'll start to clean them. But then I'll rotate out into, you know, like a new set of fountain pens, right? So like I have enough where I can have this full rotation. But I don't necessarily track it per se, right? I don't say, okay, it's been X amount of months since I've used this pen. It's time for this. I just do it more on, hey, I've missed using this pen. And then that eventually gets me narrowed down into like a grouping of pens that I just don't use anymore. So that's when I know it's time to sell them. So I totally feel guilty about the ones not being used. But I also do have a rotation for the pens that I do use.

Adina Hurley: Myke is counting his pens.

Myke Hurley: I have about 30 pens in rotation that are inked. And actually, they're just all the ones that sit on my desk. And over the space of like, I don't know, two weeks or whatever, they'll all get used, right? So like they're all being used because I'm purposefully picking up and using multiple pens a day for different purposes. Whether it's taking my show notes, I'll use two different pens for that. Maybe to write headers and stuff. And then the other will make the notes. And then the same for my journal. So I'll pick up one pen, write all my kind of prompts in with one pen and switch over and use the other. And this comes from that idea of like, I have a lot of pens that I really love. I want them around me. I don't want them in a drawer. The stuff that I have in drawers, and I have lots of pens in drawers, is mostly stuff that I have moved on from. You know, like things that were earlier in the hobby, types of pens that I'm not really that interested. You know, I have a ton of machined metal pens, right? I just don't use pens like that anymore. But I hold on to them. Someday I'll clean some of them out. Like as in sell some of them off or give some of them away. But the value, the pens that I think that actually hold value that are worth selling are the pens that I'm using. Right. Right.

Brad Dowdy: I mean, that's a pretty good place to be. You know, I think I have some that really need to be like rehomed and sold.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. Yeah, but your situation is like, is mine, but turned up to 11.

Fountain Pens

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. But my issue is that I use, like fountain pens play like a small to no more than half of my writing instruments, right? Like I use so many other products like standard pens and pencils that, you know, like that's why I can't have 30 fountain pens ink because I'm using, you know, gel pens and pencils and all these other weird stuff that I use on the daily. So, yeah, it's definitely a guilt fest over here sometimes.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. Aviv B asks, I have a Sailor Pro gear that has taken one too many falls. There's cracked in a couple of places, but it still writes beautifully. Can I move the nib to some other pen? And should I?

Brad Dowdy: So, the answer is yes, but it's complicated, right? So, you can absolutely, you can move it to another Sailor Pro gear tomorrow. Yeah, but that's probably not. Pull that nib.

Myke Hurley: That's the easiest way to do it. It's probably not what you want, right? Yeah. You just have another great nib from another Sailor.

Brad Dowdy: Right, right. But that's not, that doesn't help anything, right? So, can I move the nib to some other pen?

Brad Dowdy: Off the shelf, no. But you can get a pen made to fit a Sailor nib. And that might not be the answer you're looking for here. Yeah. But off the shelf, like, you're going to have to have some form, like, people will use Twisbees to manipulate feeds and reshape things to get them to fit, right? You could take that nib and somehow fit it into, like, a Twisbee or a Conid or whatever that people will use. And you can find ways to get that manipulation done. And I don't think that's the question you're asking. Like, I don't think you want to get out, like, you know, the, all the different tools that it would need to get one into a Twisbee.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, and if you can't do it, it's expensive to have it done.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. But then I've had, then I've bought pens from other companies that, you know, like Brooks, Jonathan Brooks, Carolina Pen Company, has made a barrel for my Pilot Falcon, right? Like, you can get these different types of things to fit in. And Tony in chat is actually saying Flexible Nib Factory, which we've talked about before. They sell sailor housings where you could, it's basically the pre-made into a Yovo or Bach fitting. So you could use that nib into one of those pens. So that's probably, that's your best option. Because really the only other option is, like, really, really hacking other pens or having someone make you a barrel that will fit that nib and feed, which is possible. But that's, you know, several hundred dollars at a minimum. Yeah, check out the Flexible Nib Factory. Actually, I probably need to do that so I could talk about them more. It's just one on those, on that list that I never get to sometimes.

Adina Hurley: I feel this was a cautionary tale for me in case, from Myke, in case I drop any more pens. We've all done it. Yeah, stop doing it. You can't, it's difficult to get it into another pen, okay?

Myke Hurley: This is the problem. If you have a specific pen that you really do love, you know, there can come a certain point where it's beyond saving. Mm-hmm. And the thing that I will add to Jessica's question, you know, if you're hearing this and you're like, oh, that's a bummer. I'm just assuming you have a standard nib on your Pro Gear. You did not have any work done to it. That is just an assumption that I'm making. The nib experience, one of the things that makes me love Sailor as a brand so much, the nib experience from pen to pen, very similar. Like, their nibs are very, very good. So if you do get to the point where this beloved Pro Gear needs to be put out to pasture, if you have the ability to replace it with another Pro Gear, you will probably have a very similar experience. So it's unlikely that you have a one-off, you know?

Adina Hurley: You know, I think it was a month or two ago that I came to Myke and told him that, you know, I think I get why you both love Sailor so much. Because I liked Platinum when I tried it in person a bit more than Sailor, but Platinum is not as exciting as Sailor is. And it doesn't have as many color combinations and it's just so beautiful and everything they put out there. And the nib, it's just, it works every time on every pen. It just works. So I'm starting to be in Club Sailor as well.

Myke Hurley: I continue to consider it a great shame that Platinum are not more daring. Yeah. Because, you know, I think pound for pound, Platinum nibs are better.

Platinum Nibs

Myke Hurley: But. I would agree. They just, they don't produce enough excitement in their models. You know, they'll have a couple a year. We were just talking about their next release. But I think at a certain point, they're even starting to play that safe. Like, I remember the first time Platinum did this years ago. I don't remember which one it was, Brad. But like when they started doing these wild 3776s, it was like, oh, yeah, here we go. But then over time, it's kind of been, it's getting a bit iterative what they're doing in that line. And I would really love to see them be more daring with their middle to high end, like consumer pens. And they're just not. The 3776 is a great platform. Like, look at the 1911, right? They're basically the same pen. And there are so many exciting colors in a 1911 that we just don't get in the 3776.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I'd like to see it in the, I think they're missing out in the Procyon range. That's like a $60 Twisby level pen. That's awesome. And it's like, you know, they'll do the five colors and just leave it be and it'll be great. And it's like, you know, lean into that a little bit more. Like, what can we do in like that $50 to $200 range? Like, Platinum would crush that range if they, you know, decided to. But that doesn't seem to be their move.

Myke Hurley: Sarah Beth Hunt asks, do you think the scramble for Retro 51s will slow down now that we know they're not closing? Or do you think it will continue?

Brad Dowdy: I think it will continue.

Myke Hurley: It depends.

Brad Dowdy: It does. It depends. The next year is going to matter. Yeah. How we answer this question.

Myke Hurley: Because the thing, the scramble... Was there long before we knew that their future was uncertain. Yeah. You know, like every single Retro 51 sells out. They always sell out if they're limited. And it's been that way for the best part of five years, right? Like, absolutely no problem. They sell out all the time. But they are under new management. They're under a new direction. I think it would... I think it always has depended on the designs. The designs had to be good. And they had a very, very good record. I don't think that they sold out just because. They sold out because they were good. And... Right. They have to continue that. We'll have to see.

Brad Dowdy: My gut tells me that we're going to see...

Brad Dowdy: We're not going to realize it's under new ownership. My gut says, like, it's going to continue with the traditional pre-dump everything on the market Retro 51 that we saw in 2020. That's funny.

Brad Dowdy: That's what my gut says. But we'll see. All right. We'll know in about a year. Yeah. And we might have a different answer.

Myke Hurley: And I'll... Adina, what do you think, actually?

Brad Dowdy: Do you use any Retro 51s, Adina? Like, for sketching, drawing, writing?

Adina Hurley: No. I think it's good for note-taking better than drawing. I've only ever had one that I stole from Myke. The Twister one, I think.

Myke Hurley: It's the red and white stripe one.

Adina Hurley: And years later, I still haven't changed its refill.

Adina Hurley: I don't know that...

Myke Hurley: You use the Mark 1 more, don't you?

Adina Hurley: Oh. Would you consider that a Retro 51? Well, no.

Myke Hurley: It's the same refill. No, no, no. It's the same refill.

Adina Hurley: And that's another one. I'm too lazy with these things. I don't use them as much. But I think Retro 51 has the same Sailor vibe that different pens will get different people. Although, what might change now, unless they prove otherwise, is that fact that it doesn't have the founder stamp of approval anymore. And might be people have connection with that and the heritage and the history. So they'll need to show somehow how they'll carry that through and make nods. It depends how they'll go in the next year, as you're saying, too.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, I think it's one of those things where you can have that founder dilemma that maybe, you know, like, George's role in the company was more than we thought. Or as much as we thought, right? And that he maybe has a good sense of taste. Or maybe the three heads might be better than one, right? What are the guys' names again? I don't know. I forgot the three names. Andy, Joe, and one other one. And so, like, maybe it will be that that creativity will flow out, right? I completely agree. It is definitely a we're going to have to wait and see on that one.

Adina Hurley: Yeah, because it's so easy with companies that change management like that in the space where people love their products. In that whether they think that the decisions and the new designs feel like the new owners get what the original founders were doing. And that thing that so can be quantified or explained really well that made people fall in love with it in the first place.

Myke Hurley: Or do they think they need to make their mark?

Adina Hurley: Yeah. Yeah. So that's another one. Yeah. Good luck.

Brad Dowdy: Good luck. And I still look at it from a broader market perspective, right? Retro 51 is pretty ingrained in places that we're not really involved in.

Brad Dowdy: So, yeah, we'll see.

Myke Hurley: It'd be interesting to see if they do branded stuff. Because they always did some Disney and Harley, right? They did the bands one. Do you remember the Kiss ones?

Brad Dowdy: Those were awesome. I'm just not a Kiss fan, but they crushed those pins.

Myke Hurley: It seems like there is a line between the Kiss pens and the Harley Davidson pens, right? Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: And that's what I'm talking about, right?

Myke Hurley: What areas will they attack? Are they going to go? I would like to see them do more branded stuff, but which brands would they work with? I don't know. Yep. All right. Final question today comes from Fractaloon. I heard that you say that sometimes you have a problem with small nibs. What difference does a nib physical size make? Is it just an aesthetic thing or is there some other issue? And I think we were talking about this in regards to the Wancho Japan Steel Sailor, right? Where we both agreed that the nib was too small on that pen. Okay. For me, it is purely an aesthetic thing.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. I was trying to even remember where we would have said that because I don't really think that's a thing unless the barrel is large enough to outweigh the size of the nib visually. Like I said, I have a Sailor Ebonite pen where it's not the bigger, the larger 21K size. It's the smaller 14K. Yeah. Totally an aesthetic thing, right? The size didn't necessarily match the build and the shape of the pen. So yeah, that's just like a personal preference looks type of thing. I personally, there's not that much difference. The only thing you'll see with a nib size is the larger the nib, the more bounce it will have in it, right? Just because it's just the tines, when that tine slit gets longer and meddable, meddable, meddable is flexible is what meddable means, Myke. It's very nice. Keep trying. Just keep trying. You'll get that. We all believe in you. Meddable. The nibs are meddable. It becomes more flexible, right? It's just like how it's going to be with a larger size nib. Yeah. So that's kind of the only thing you'll see. You'll see a little bit more softness in the nib. And then when it's gold and large, it really gets soft. So that's kind of the only difference. But yeah, we were speaking of it from an aesthetic standpoint. Did the complete design change in our eyes and just how the pen looks with a small nib and a large barrel kind of thing?

Myke Hurley: All right. I think that's it.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. I'm out of words.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. We've run the end of Brad for the day. So someone's going to go put a coin in Brad and we can get him back up and running again. If you want to find links to today's episode, you can go to relay.fm slash pen addict slash 448. We have lots of links there. That is where you will also find links on where to follow Adina online. You should primarily, I believe, follow at sticking out comics on Instagram. But Adina is also at Adina Hurley on Instagram as well. If you want to follow her personal account. Well, I'm sure that she would want everybody to follow the comics account primarily now.

Adina Hurley: I don't mind it. But yeah, primarily that one. That's where I spend a lot of time.

Myke Hurley: But if you want to follow both, go right ahead. If you want to find Brad online, go to penaddict.com, knock.co. Brad is penaddict on Instagram and Dowdyism on Twitter. Go to twitch.tv slash penaddict on Tuesdays and Thursdays at 10 a.m. Eastern. You will find Brad streaming unboxings and showing off new products and all that kind of fun stuff. I am at imike, I-M-Y-K-E, and I stream pretty much every Friday, kind of around the same time at 10 a.m. Eastern at mike.live. And that is primarily keyword-related stuff. If you want to support our sponsors, it helps support the show. And we thank them for their support of this week's episode. That is Pen Chalet, Harry's, and ExpressVPN. But of course, thank you for listening. And we'll be back next time. Until then, say goodbye, everybody. Goodbye, everybody.

Adina Hurley: I finally learned this one.