The Pen Addict 361/transcript

The Pen Addict Podcast Transcript
Episode:	361
Title:	Full-Time NibSMITH
Release Date:	May 29th, 2019
Hosts:	Brad Dowdy Myke Hurley
Guests:	Dan Smith
Additional Information
Official page:	Episode 361
Audio File:	Audio Episode 361
Podcast page:	The Pen Addict 361
Length:	4545 min <br />0.75 h <br /> minutes
Previous Transcript	Next Transcript

Myke Hurley: From RelayFM, this is The Pen Addict, episode 361, and today's show is brought to you by Eero. My name is Myke Hurley, and I have the pleasure, as always, of being joined by The Pen Addict himself, Mr. Brad Dowdy.

Brad Dowdy: Hello, Myke Hurley, how are you?

Myke Hurley: I am fine and dandy, Brad Dowdy. Fine and dandy, indeed.

Guest Introduction

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I am fine and dandy as well, because, Myke, we're doing something very different in this episode. Because it's not just this episode, I'll no longer be able to refer to it as that. This will be our first ever doubleheader, two-part podcast episode, because we have a very special guest. One Mr. Dan Smith from The Nib Smith. What's up, Dan?

Speaker 02: Hey, Brad, how you doing, man? Thanks for having me on, guys.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, yeah, sure, sure. You know, Myke, there was a mention last week, as we wrapped up our podcast, that we'd be, you know, maybe doing something a little different these episodes for these next two weeks, because we're going to be doing a little traveling, got a can, put a show in the can, and we talked about we'd be doing some horror stories. And I figured we'd just bring on the horror story himself for these two shows, and just go for it. What do you think? I think that was obviously what we meant at the time. Little did you know, Dan, we had you set up from the get-go. Nice.

Speaker 02: I wouldn't expect anything less from you guys.

Myke Hurley: This is just one of those things where once Brad started to put together the prep, because Brad has done a fantastic job with the preparation for this episode, we realized that we'd actually have to cut too much out to try and fit this into, like, a regularly-sized episode. So, as well, considering, so obviously one of the things that we're going to talk about with Dan over the next two episodes is nib grinding. And that is something that is of great interest to a lot of our listenership for a few reasons, like, what is it? How does it work? How should I get into it myself? And all that kind of stuff. And then when we started to ask for the Ask TPA questions, we got so many that we have decided that we're going to split it in two. So, on this episode, we're going to kind of look at Dan's history a bit and talk about the nibsmith and turning from nib grinding into selling, like, becoming an actual store. And we talk about the nibsmith all the time on the show. But then in our next episode, we're going to do a real big kind of deep dive on just nib grinding and answering your questions.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, so, Dan, you good with us breaking out all the skeletons in your closet and figuring out where, how this whole Dan Smith thing came to happen, right? Like, you're good?

Speaker 02: Yeah, absolutely.

Brad Dowdy: So, I've gotten to know you, I guess, in person over the last few years of pen shows, but we've known each other online going back a little bit. But during those times, like, I don't even know, like, what's Dan's, you know, pen origin story? Has he always been a fountain pen guy? Has he been into stationery before? Or did this come, you know, later in life, you know, as you've kind of, you know, figured things out, you know, with how you use pens and paper? So, where did this all start? Just the pen thing in general about your love for fountain pens?

Speaker 02: Well, with pens in general, it's just been, for as long as I can remember, you know, going to the stores with my parents, my favorite aisle was a stationery aisle. Always looking to see what new pens were out. Of course, I tried some of the cheap fountain pens, and they never really worked for me. But, yeah, always obsessed with pens. Never got much into the stationery side of it as far as paper goes itself. But, you know, as I got older and through high school and stuff like that, I didn't kind of waned a little bit. But once I graduated from college, I remember very specifically, I was walking through an antique store, and I saw some old vintage fountain pens. I mean, I didn't know anything about them at the time. But I remembered my grandfather used to use them. He had this huge coffee mug on his desk, and they were full of dip pens and fountain pens, and that's kind of what sparked my interest in fountain pens, really. And so, after that, I went home and started Googling and found Fountain Pen Network, and I guess it was just all downhill from there.

Brad Dowdy: Uphill. Yeah, uphill. Totally uphill. How long ago was this? Like, when, like, so, like, all through your school years, like, it mattered, like, what you wrote with. But you really, you know, it's okay. You know, I want something a little bit different than after school and after college. You're like, I'm going to get into this fountain pen thing. How long ago was that, do you think?

Speaker 02: Right. So, that would have been real early 2008 is when I really got into it.

Shared Interests

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So, like, a little over a decade ago. Yeah. I find it funny, Myke. I think you were a little bit this way, and I was a little bit this way. We always, like, stationary, but we had someone in our lives, like, someone gave you, you know, one of your family members gave you a Mont Blanc. My grandfather was an artist, so I'm around all this stuff all the time. I always find that interesting, you know, someone like Dan having that.

Myke Hurley: You could go back through a lot of our interviews, and that is a very, very similar theme. Like, both of those things. One of, like, as a kid, I always liked stationary for school or whatever. But then also that there was somebody in that person's life that was an inspiration to them in some way. Like, I think there is a very consistent theme throughout all of this. And I think it kind of makes sense that there's somebody that we look up to who uses these types of products. And then also that kind of, like, and maybe even for a lot of us as a family member, that is also the person that would take us to buy the stuff. True. Yeah.

Speaker 02: And I got really lucky because when I was on FPN, I found a guy who was local to me. And so we met up, and he actually, you know, he's been in the hobby for years before that. So he brought all his stuff. He showed me. We had a store that actually carried fountain pens, like legit pens. And so I had someone just usher me right in. He got me introduced into vintage. And, yeah, I sort of got escorted right into the fountain pen world.

Brad Dowdy: That's super helpful and super important. We talk about how, you know, you know, our friend Thomas Hall, friend of the world, Thomas Hall, who really took care of me in the beginning as far as fountain pen goes. It's just, like, sending both me and Myke, for that matter, just teaching and teaching us and make sure, you know, we understood what things, how things worked and why things existed, how they do. And he still does to this day. Myke and I are in an Instagram, a years-long Instagram private messaging session with Thomas where he's just like, look at this. You should look into this. Thomas is the first. It's great to have. And the worst. It's great to have. Yeah. But it's having these mentors is super important. So you go from that and you're, like, starting to figure all this thing out.

Myke Hurley: Oh, but Thomas has gone next level with me recently, though.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. You and him have a watch problem that I don't, like, I just ignore those messages now.

Myke Hurley: It's bad. It's real bad.

Discussing Podcast Origins

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. It's great. But it's terrible. It's bad. It's bad. So, Dan, when did you decide that I want to talk about fountain pens on the internet? Because that's how I first heard of Dan Smith at a site called FP Geeks. So I had the Pen Addict blog. And, you know, you're always, you know, when you're writing online, you're always trying to find more people who do the same type of things online. And then FP Geeks popped up. And that's how I heard about you. So what made you go from just learning about fountain pens, using fountain pens, to say, hey, I'm going to share some things online about fountain pens?

Speaker 02: Yeah. So I met all kinds of people on FPN. And there was someone there. We thought, you know, we could maybe do a forum that was run a little bit differently, you know, where there was room for improvement. And so FP Geeks actually started as another message board. Okay. And shortly after that, we created a blog and we did a lot of giveaways to get people interested in the message board. And so after the giveaways, we kind of didn't really know what to do with the blog. And it sat there for a little while. And one day when I was looking, trying to find out new releases, I realized that there was no one website where you could go and see all the new products from all the different brands. I mean, you could always go to a retailer's website, but you're only going to find out about the new stuff they carry. And so that's really where the idea for, you know, the core of FP Geeks came from is we wanted to share all new products from all new brands. And after that, it just snowballed into reviews and podcasts and videos and pen shows. And yeah, it just went from there.

Brad Dowdy: What did you think about that at the time that you could take this most analog of writing instrument and have this wide ranging discussion online, not just in words on a message board, but, you know, you could share news and information and could, you know, create podcasts or videos of the things you were doing. And like, how into all of that type of creation were you at the time?

Speaker 02: Well, when it first started, very little. I mean, it was just step by step. It was really just sharing, hey, this is new. Check this out. And the feedback we got was incredible. We were like, holy cow, people actually love this. And so then it was, you know, people had questions about certain pens that we use and we're like, OK, well, let's start doing reviews. And I really enjoyed getting into that analytical side of the pen itself, you know, how it writes, how it's made, how it feels. And then the whole video process and editing that was new. And I just loved every step of it along the way and always continue to get really good feedback.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I, oh, you said it earlier when you were describing what FP Geeks was. I always told people like for new release and new information, like that's where you wanted to go. Because that's not something that I ever covered, like, you know, the new products, like every company's new products. Y'all were always like pumping out like all the releases. Like you could just go to FP Geeks and like find all the new information out there, which I always thought was cool and like a very good resource for that type of thing. What was your what was your favorite thing about that FP about that FP Geeks era? Because that's like the blog doesn't exist anymore, but the message board lives on. But like what what did you enjoy the most about that time, you know, working with FP Geeks and, you know, having that site become so popular?

Speaker 02: Oh, wow. Really just the community that that built up around it, not only just online, but in person, because we did a number of shows where we would go and, you know, report from the show and try and bring that show experience online. I forgot about that. Yeah. To let people know that, hey, that, you know, there's this is actually happening in the world world. You need to get to one of these things because, you know, who would have guessed? Right. You know, even today I tell people I'm going to a pen show and they're like, what?

Myke Hurley: Yeah.

Speaker 02: So, no, it was great. And I've met so many people through that and built so many relationships that that was really the best part out of all of that.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. How long did FP Geeks last, if you can recall? Oh, wow. Three or four years, something like that. I mean, like I said, the message board still lives on, but the blog. Right. It was probably close to four years. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. That's right. And that's your your your last statement in the part. I forgot about how you'd visit pen shows and like do like this on site report thing like this. These this news guy from the from the pen show. I totally forgot about that, but that's perfect. Like, what was your first pen show? Like, how did you go? How did you decide to attend your first pen show and see what that's all about?

Speaker 02: So I know it was Chicago, but I can't remember if it was 2011 or 2012.

Speaker 02: And we just went just to go check this out to see what a pen show was.

Speaker 02: And then after that, I mean, I think the next year we we hit three or four. And the year after that, we you know, we did the same. I mean, we were addicted, really.

Brad Dowdy: What do you recall what you thought about that first pen show? Because I remember my first pen show. I think it was Atlanta. It was either 2011 or 2012. It was definitely Atlanta. But I remember just the difference between year one and year two, where year one was like such a blur. My first ever pen show is like, yeah, it happened. And I was there, but it was just so overwhelming. And I couldn't figure it out until like year two was like, OK, I've got the flow now. Do you remember what it was like that first time?

Speaker 02: I remember thinking this is insane. You know, we can completely overwhelmed.

Speaker 02: Yeah. And it was just a blur. I mean, there were so many pens. You just you couldn't spend enough time and look at all of them. Right.

Pen Collection Focus Shifts

Brad Dowdy: So back back around that time frame when FP Geeks is rolling and you're starting to go to pen shows, what is your pen collection look like? What is Dan, you know, seven or eight years ago looking for in a pen? What type of things were you into at that time?

Speaker 02: Oh, it was mostly vintage. It was mostly vintage for a long time, actually. Lots of Schaefer balances, Parker 51s, Vacumatics, Dual Folds, Skylines. And that's really what I was hunting at those first few pen shows. Of course, I did have lots of modern stuff. And I think at that Chicago show, I made my first purchase from Brian Greer at Chatterley. It was nice. It was a Delta in that turquoise celluloid. And it was the most I had ever spent on a pen. And I was like, what am I doing? This is crazy. But, you know, I loved it. It was great. And then slowly over the years, that's transitioned into more of a modern collection.

Brad Dowdy: Were you intimidated by the vintage buying back in the beginning? Because we get that a lot. It's like, how do I buy my first first vintage pen? And you seem to not be too concerned with that in the beginning. You know, am I getting a good quality? Has this been restored? Is it going to work? Am I going to have to fix it up? Was there anything you had in your arsenal back then that made you feel comfortable buying vintage pens kind of right out the gate?

Speaker 02: Yeah. So my buddy who helped me kind of get into fountain pens, he was big into vintage too. And I guess it just kind of came natural. And when I was really getting into it and learning, I was just buying vintage pens off eBay by the handful. And I knew they wouldn't work. But that was part of why I was buying them. I wanted to figure out how to restore them. You know, I found a few guides online about how to fix them up. And so I would just buy them, fix them up, flip them and buy more. And so I was really comfortable with vintage. I didn't have a problem with them at all.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So I think as I was putting together these show notes, I was trying to decide when we first met because we knew known each other online for a little bit. Even though we didn't talk that much, like we weren't talking all the time. And then I want to say it was 2016 in DC was the first time we met, which I put in the show notes, a little episode that happened during that event that sealed our bond forever. Yeah. And we've told these stories before. And Dan and I will be happy to tell you any stories from that particular pen show. But we don't need to discuss that today. But I think at the time you were you had I don't know if you were working for Kenro Industries or you were just like doing stuff at shows for them. So how did that transition come? Like it's come quick, right? It's like you were discovering fountain pens and then, OK, you made a message board and then a blog and then you started to go to pen shows. And now, you know, maybe you can pick up some gigs from like, you know, fountain pen people in the industry. What what was that like? Is that something is that how that kind of transition worked?

Speaker 02: A little bit. Yeah. Kenro, they've we've always had a really good relationship. They were they worked with us on the blog, you know, from the very beginning.

Background History

Speaker 02: They've always been very helpful in getting products into us and stuff. And so there was kind of an area, a period of time after FP Geeks and I was kind of in between jobs and they helped me out. And so I was there like like social media and content creator for a while. Right, right. And so then I was helping them at the show that year. And that's that's how that came about at the DC show.

Brad Dowdy: OK. What was that your first DC DC pen show? Do you recall or had you gone there for FP Geeks before then?

Speaker 02: Yeah, I've been there for FP Geeks. And I want to say that might have been my second show. OK. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: That's always a trip. Myke did not get to experience the previous hotel for the DC pen show. But it was just as much of a cluster as it is now. But it's just so it's so big and overwhelming. It's like, I don't know. I get scared of telling people you should go to the DC pen show because it's a lot to take in. It is. Yeah. All right. So this seems like the point to where you're kind of in. Right. Your fountain pens is your thing. And there's a little bit of a transition from, OK, I'm going to create these things online and do social media work to start to think about doing your own thing. So I want to get into that. But first, Myke, let's hear about our wonderful sponsor, our good friends at Eero.

Sponsorship Break

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Brad Dowdy: Boy, do I want to tell you about it, Myke. Because I don't know if you know, but it is now officially summertime in my household, which means my kids are out of school, which means they're destroying my internet connection at all hours of the day and night. And you know what Eero does, Myke? The Eero lets me block them from the internet when I don't want them to be on the internet. All through the app on my phone. You can make these little profiles and you can assign them to specific devices. In my case, specifically my daughter's iPhone, that gets its own profile. So let's just say there's lots of conversation about my fine and wonderful Eero device in our house because it works very well in limiting what content and what time of day you want your children to access said content. That's actually really useful. It's massively useful.

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Brad Dowdy: All right, Dan. So you've gone from, you know, this, these few years of kind of figuring things out in the background and you're, you're all in on this fountain pen business. How did you decide to become part of the business? How did you decide to, you know, either, you know, work on nibs, repair pens, become a retailer? And how did this transition happen from, say, around that time frame, 2016, 2017?

Brad Dowdy: What gave you the, the, the jumpstart to want to do this?

Speaker 02: Well, so for a long time I was just doing nib grinds and, and restoration work by word of mouth. And so after going to these shows and figuring out, Hey, I might actually be able to do this. The whole idea was just to do something to get me to be able to go to more pen shows.

Brad Dowdy: And so. Isn't that funny how we try so hard to do that? Yeah.

Speaker 02: So, so doing nib work seemed like the perfect excuse. I mean, heck, if I could break even and still get to a pen show, I was happy with that. But it turns out it's, it's been a lot better than that.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So you, you started the nibsmith. When did you start that? And importantly, how did you come up with the name?

Speaker 02: So it was, I think in later, either late 2016 or early 2017. And, um, I was talking to a mutual buddy of ours, uh, Myke Dudek, and he actually came up with the name. And, uh, I was like, dude, that's golden.

Myke Hurley: I hate how creative Dudek is.

Speaker 02: It's so frustrating. Oh, I know it. Right. It is.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. It's like, it's, it's a perfect name, but because it's just right there in front of you, it's like, Oh my God, how did I not see this? Right. Right.

Speaker 02: Exactly.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah.

Speaker 02: But, uh, so. Dudek's good. And I worked with, uh, um, Matthew Morris to come up with the logo and everything. And it was great to be able to, to work with guys in the community who are, who are so close to all this. Um, that just like kind of makes it even more special, you know, totally agree with that.

Nib Grinding Discussion Begins

Brad Dowdy: So let's get into the, the nib grinding and repairing. And, you know, as Myke and I tease in the beginning of the show, this, this show is actually going to be the ultimate tease because we're really, really going to get into the nuts and bolts of the nib grinding in part two of this episode. But for this conversation, what made you want to get into offering nib grinds and how did you learn?

Speaker 02: Um, well, when I first got started, um, my, my buddy who was local, he was kind of introducing me to, you know, what stubs and italics were and all this. And I was like, I can do that. And so I just went and grabbed some of my old cheap pens that I bought on eBay and started grinding and, um, went through a lot of nibs, but eventually, you know, I mean, I got it. I figured it out. He tried them and he's like, dude, this is really good. Like you, you should be doing this for other people. You should be charging for this. And I was kind of, you know, whatever, if you say so. And so he told his buddies and I just kind of spread word of mouth really. But then after that, it's just, um, I don't know, I guess I just enjoyed the process. It was, uh, almost meditative. Like for me, really, it's just, I could kind of, um, just sit down and grind and kind of, you know, let my mind wander. I don't, I don't know how else to explain it. Really?

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. I always enjoyed it. That makes sense. Cause I, I've seen you work over these past few years and I can see the little zone you get in. And if I have enough nerve to ask you something while you're doing something, you're like, huh? You're like, I, you're like, you don't know what's going on. You shut it all down, which I want to talk about that, that later actually doing a nib grind in front of someone, um, because that would freak me out. Not just, you know, taking someone else's property and essentially destroying it in front of them. Um, you know, so what, what was the, um, what was the waste rate like in the beginning? What was the, what was the ratio of good versus bad and how quickly did that turn around? Because that's super intimidating to, even if it's like you bought like a hundred of, you know, 50 cent Chinese pens, it's still like, what am I doing here?

Speaker 02: Yeah, no, it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. Um, I don't know. I probably got two or three good ones out of every 10 I'd say.

Brad Dowdy: Right. Right.

Speaker 02: You know, really early on. But, um, you know, once, once I got it figured out, it was, um, it turned around fairly quickly. Um, so, so it wasn't that painful.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Yeah. So what would you say there's a, almost like a math or science to it? Like once you get it down, you know, kind of exactly the, the path you want to take in getting to the end result, or is it more of an, like an art? Like, is it, you know, more of a feel and just kind of, uh, the art of it?

Speaker 02: Um, you know, there's definitely a feel to the tools that you're using, but really, um, it, it is just kind of math really. It's, I mean, it's, you know, each grind has its basic shape. And once you learn what that shape is and how to grind it on that little tiny tipping, it's, it's fairly easily repeatable.

Transition to Pen Shows

Brad Dowdy: What was your first pen show where you set up a table to be the nibsmith? Oh, that's a good question.

Speaker 02: Um, I think that was 2016, um, in Chicago maybe.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So what, what, what was that like just getting ready to sit behind your first table at a pen show? Do you recall like how different that feeling is than attending?

Speaker 02: The most nerve wracking thing I've probably ever done. Um, you know, cause it's one thing to grind nibs in private with no one watching you, but when you've got the owner sitting, you know, literally 12 inches away from you and you know, I mean, if you make a slip, you know, it's just, yeah, it was really nerve wracking. Um, but it, but it was very exciting and, and it was even more rewarding when you handed the pen to them and they just got this big old smile on their face. I mean, that's the best part.

Brad Dowdy: I think I might've been at that show, which I wouldn't have realized it was your first show, but I do remember. And I think, you know, what I want to talk about next is the transition from that singular table with your nib grinding equipment. Right. And did you even have, like, did you have like one or two trays of pens at that time or, or none? Were you just doing it? I don't think I did. Yeah.

Speaker 02: No, I think it was probably not until later that year or early the next year when I really started bringing pens.

Brad Dowdy: And even in the beginning, it was, it was literally like two trays of pens. I'd go over and see like, you know, like, um, all the like Aurora stuff, right. They'd be like two trays of, uh, of a bunch of, a bunch of pens. So what made you want to add in that type of business to your already, you know, your nib grinding business? What, what was the thought process beside behind let's go into more?

Speaker 02: Well, I think it was at that point where I was like, I really enjoy doing this. I want to, you know, build it. I want to see if I can actually, you know, do this full time at some point. Um, you know, or at least a solid, you know, side gig where I can go to more shows and just, just keep doing this, keep having fun. And kind of the, the key part of that was I need to make a little bit more money. I need to, you know, start selling pens. And I had some good connections with Kenro so I could get Aurora. And I think I had Pelican at that point. And those were selling reasonably well. And so after, you know, the next two or three shows, um, I started to invest into more of the retail side and it just kept picking up. You know, I kept selling more pens. I kept buying more, kept selling more. And it just grew to what it is now.

Brad Dowdy: Why do you think you sell more pens? I know the answer to this, but I'm going to make you say it.

Speaker 02: Oh, I'd kind of like to hear your answer. I guess I don't have a good one for it.

Brad Dowdy: You offer a service that other retailers don't. And I'll catch some flack from that. I'm sure from my friends in the retail business. Um, but you do something different. And for someone like myself and for someone like our pen addict listeners, we're still pretty new to this, right? And you can take them through an entire process of purchasing and QC and modifying if they're interested in one spot.

Brad Dowdy: What gave you the, the idea? Did that just happen like naturally? It's like, well, I'm grinding nibs and okay, that's going well. And let me pick up a few pens that, you know, people are coming to the pen show. Maybe they'll want to buy some pens. Oh, maybe I can add this service in to take that pen that they just bought and do something that no one else can do. And that's what I think the success is in the brand and why we're seeing it like grow like it is. But did that come naturally?

Speaker 02: The two go so well hand in hand together. It was, it would have been foolish of me to not offer that. And I know there is another retailer who offers nib work and grinds. And, um, from what I've seen, it's, it's always extra. And I, you know, had a little advantage where I could offer it free, you know, once you get to a certain price point and, um, definitely 90% of the pens I sell have nib work on them. So I think it's worked really well.

Workflow Changes

Brad Dowdy: How has that changed your workflow? Because this is what, when I, I'm just intimidated to walk by you because that's a lot. Like I see you now and we're going to, we'll expand on this a little bit more, but I see the scope now. And that's also why I wanted to get you on the show because things have changed really quick. I feel, um, for you. And I wanted to talk about more about how, like, what's your workflow like for one of

Speaker 02: these shows now, as far as network goes. Um, online I've, I've stopped accepting mail order nib work, but I still do it at shows. You can bring your pens to me and I set up appointments online on my website. So you can sign up, you know, a couple of weeks ahead of the show, reserve your spot. You don't have to, you know, rush to the table first thing in the morning. And, um, then I also do, if you buy a pen at the show, I can adjust it or grind it, you know, there on the spot. And the reason I can, I can do all that now with all the tables and pens that I sell is because of my wife and also Jacqueline, who's been coming to a lot of the shows with me. They, they run the tables better than I could imagine. I mean, they, they let me just focus on the nib work and, and get the nib work done. Um, and the workflow is really steady. Um, it's, it's actually really pretty simple now.

Brad Dowdy: Do you have a packing process you go through? Do you have like a checklist? Like bringing now it used to just be you and your nib grinder and a case or two of pens. Now it's all the things like tubs. Like I, uh, I filled in for a couple of hours of you, uh, for you and the Arkansas pen show and you know, me and your wife were like climbing over all the boxes and things that you have to bring. Like it's, you bring a lot of stuff. Like what is that process of just like picking and packing and keeping all that stuff organized to even head to a show for a weekend?

Speaker 02: It's insane. It's, it's basically take everything out of the inventory room and try and put it in the van. I mean, really that's, that's what it comes down to. Um, but it's, it's so hard to figure out what to bring and then how to pack it. Um, because you never know what's going to sell well at a show. Um, perfect case in point is the new Leonardo. I got, I, I probably sold everything I had in Atlanta and then go to Chicago. And I think I sold one. Really? Yeah. It's, it's crazy. Um, you just never know. And it's the same way with, you know, lamey two thousands or vanishing points. I mean, something's really popular somewhere and then dead somewhere else. So it's, it's challenging. And that's, that's one thing that makes it really difficult.

Brad Dowdy: What, what does it look like, like in the future for you? Because like, I see this from the outside, not knowing like how like tough it is on the inside, just scope wise. I'm talking about it just from like the size and the growth of what I've seen for as an outsider. Do you want to push this further? Like, do you have a day job? Like, that's one thing I don't even know about you. Do you want to do this full time? Like, do you want to do a dozen pin shows a year instead of, I don't know how many you do now, maybe five, you know, what does the plan look like for the Nibsmith right now?

Speaker 02: Yeah. Up until now I've been doing roughly six or seven shows a year. Um, and I did, uh, have a full-time job up until recently. And, uh, you guys didn't know I was going to announce this here, but, um, I'm actually really happy to say that I'm now full-time.

Brad Dowdy: Oh yes. Oh, I just got chills.

Brad Dowdy: I'm excited for you. Good job.

Future Show Plans

Speaker 02: So, um, I definitely want to increase the number of shows I'm going to. Um, I want to hit all of them at some point, probably not in the same year because I think there's like 15 or something and that's just insane. Bad idea.

Brad Dowdy: Terrible idea. Yeah. I don't care how old you are.

Myke Hurley: Especially because they don't happen throughout the year either. There's like a concentrated period of time. Like, because you wouldn't be going to like one a month. There would be like some months where you're going to like four, which is not a good idea.

Speaker 02: Yeah. Right. Exactly. Um, so I'm thinking maybe 10 at most. Um, you know, I've, I've definitely got to get to Dallas and Baltimore and Raleigh and, you know, shows like that. Um, but eventually I got to hit all of them.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Wow. Um, that's awesome. I'm super happy. I like, I, you're, you're right. I didn't know that was coming. So that is, that is super cool. So yeah, well, you, you blew me out of the water there. I don't, I don't even know what to say. Like, um, other than I've seen it coming, right? Like I, as an outsider and someone who follows this, you kind of get a feel for what's happening in the bigger industry. Um, you know, getting to at least some of the pen shows that I do, I can't do everything. I can't know everything, but when you get around a little bit, you can start to paint this picture. And there's this guy, Dan Smith with the backwards hat on over here. And he's got this table and he does really good work. And then I see Dan, you know, a year from now and he's got two tables and there's all these other pens on there. And then a year later, I see Dan and there's five tables and an online reservation system and employees. I'm really, I, I want to apologize for one of your employees, uh, Jacqueline. I mean, I love her to death, but you can do better than that, Dan.

Speaker 02: I'm taking suggestions.

Brad Dowdy: I'm teasing you, Jacqueline. I'm just saying that cause I know she's listening right now. Jacqueline's the best. She's one of my favorite people on the planet. Oh my God. She's great.

Speaker 02: I definitely couldn't do what I do at shows without her. That's for sure.

Brad Dowdy: I, just to give her some props, um, people will come to me. Like if I'm at a pen show, say like Atlanta where she's working for you and we'll just be carrying a general conversation. And they'll be like, Oh, they were so nice at, at, at the Nib Smith. And like, they wouldn't even be talking about you. They'd be talking about Jacqueline. So she's the best. So love you, Jacqueline. But I, I'm trying to figure out, I guess, is this scope and going into transitioning to full-time. Are you looking to bring in other brands? Are you looking to expand your online presence? Um, you know, what type of things are you going to do now that you've, uh, flipped the switch and, and gone to this full-time? Um, what's going to be different going forward? Or is there going to be, does there need to be anything different? Maybe not.

Speaker 02: There's going to be a little bit, uh, for sure. Um, there are still a few more brands I'd like to pick up. Of course. Um, I, it's not my goal to, you know, carry every brand under the sun. Um, I want to really carry and sell things that I'm comfortable buying myself, you know, and recommending to others. Um, so yeah, I'm thinking, you know, three or four more brands probably in the next year or so. And then I'll be focusing definitely on increasing my online presence. Um, there are just some things that are so time consuming, like photography and social media that it's, it's hard for me to do all that and still offer all the nib work. And I do want to start accepting mail order nib work again. Okay. Um, at some point, but I've, I still got lots of things I need to get set up before I can do that.

Brad Dowdy: Okay. So right now your nib services are in person, right? At, if you find me at a pin show, we'll schedule an appointment. We'll do it there. We're not taking, taking in additional work because you offer when someone buys a pin from you, not just at a show online, you can get a nib grind from you then. Right. Right. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 02: So everything I sell, um, online is available from their work. I'm just not accepting anything mail order network yet.

Brad Dowdy: Gotcha. Gotcha. So when you buy a pin from you online, does it, is it a given that that's an option? Like how does that set up work? I just hit like an across the board type of thing. I actually don't know. So tell me about just, if I want to buy a pin from you, which I've done in the past, and I know I've been able to, you know, get a nib grind done, you know, as part of my purchase. But is that for every purchase? Are there limits, restrictions? How does that work just for a new customer? What would you tell them?

Speaker 02: Uh, so right now everything is available with, with a free nib adjustment. So whether it's a smoothing or ink flow adjustment, um, that's included free charge on, on all pens. And then at a certain price point, and it's usually about two 50, depending on some pens, a little bit higher, anything over that gets free custom grinds. Okay. And anything under that, um, have to pay additional for the service. And it's outlined right there in the dropdown menu, what the prices are. And if there's no price, then it's obviously free included in the service.

Brad Dowdy: So, yeah, I didn't want to bring up that dropdown menu just because my name is in there now. But I wanted to bring that up because my name is in there now. So thank you for that. Like, I thought you were totally joking and it's been in there for weeks now. It's like, it hadn't gone away yet. I guess it's going to stay.

Brad Dowdy: Oh God. So that was, um, I bought a, the ocean sailor last year's, um, 1911, uh, no pro gear ocean from you. And I like fine Japanese nibs and I want them to have some type of line variation, like a stub or a cursive italic. And that's just one of those pens that came out so good. And I rave about it all the time. So people ask me all the time. So you and your wisdom, um, I'm not sure how wise it really was put my name on the nib grind. So thank you for that.

Speaker 02: I've only got one question about it. So it can't be that bad of a decision.

Nib Grinding Discussion

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Yeah. Good. Good. So, all right, Myke, do you have any businessy questions? Because we have a lot more to get to on how nib grinding works and why you should do it. And some of the personal stuff for Dan's, we're going to ask him what his favorites are and things like that. But in the ultimate tease, we have a part two of this episode. So anything else we want to cover this time around?

Myke Hurley: There is one thing that I wanted to touch on a little bit for as much as you're able to talk about it, Dan, is that you seem to have really good relationships with some of the larger brands, right? That you carry some large brands like Sailor and stuff like that. And I just kind of wonder, like, how much of your time is invested into building and maintaining those relationships, which I think have been in the past, at least, maybe held for companies that were larger than yours?

Speaker 02: I'll say not enough. It's not something I'm particularly good at. And so I really have to try to put an emphasis on that. But there is a significant amount of time that I spend keeping in touch with them, working with them on ideas and feedback and things like that. But really, I should be spending more time on that.

Myke Hurley: Because I imagine, like, you're in a really interesting position there, right? That you're able to sell some of these products. Like, you know, we talk about, like, I'm using today the 1911 King of Pen that I bought from you in Atlanta. And that wasn't available to everybody, right? So, like, I know that must be something that, like, must mean a lot for your continued success as well.

Speaker 02: Right. And that's part of the feedback that I give and, you know, what kind of customers are looking for and how things are moving. And then because I do look at almost every nib that I send out, I can give, you know, detailed feedback about the nibs themselves. How they're writing, how they're performing, how they're coming to me. And I think that's a valuable, you know, part of the process and especially for our relationship as well.

Business Transition

Brad Dowdy: Let me piggyback off that real quick. Did that – was your choice to go into the nibsmith full-time almost – was your hand forced essentially? Like, in a positive way, right? Like, if you had, you know, a job that you like, but at what point is your time being spent – there's not 30 hours in the day. At what point do you just, like, have to rip the Band-Aid off? Did it get to that point where, like, I see that I can make something of this and we just got to go for it? Like, were you almost forced into making this decision?

Speaker 02: Yeah, that's exactly what it was. It was – there was just so much coming from the nibsmith side.

Speaker 02: Really, performance was starting to suffer at both places. And it's like – it's going to come to a point where things are going to go downhill, you know, at one spot. And so this is what I want to do. I had all the support from my wife and so we just did it.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Your wife and kids are awesome, by the way. I've seen them at so many pen shows. I love them to death and I know you've got a really killer team behind you there. Jacqueline excluded from that, of course. So we'll get you out on that, Myke. And we'll tease everybody. You got to stick around for next week, man. This is – we're going to get into the nitty-gritty nuts and bolts of what makes Dan tick and what makes his nib grind so good and what kind of stuff Dan is into on his own. So thanks so much, Dan. Thanks for dropping the news on us too. Wow. That was pretty cool. Oh, you're welcome. Did not expect that.

Speaker 02: I'm happy I could share it with you guys first.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, that's great. That's fantastic, Myke. We are breaking news and we're breaking all grounds in podcasting industry, right?

Myke Hurley: We sure are. If you want to find show notes, information for this episode, you can go to relay.fm slash penaddict slash 361. Thanks again to Eero for their support of this show. You can go to penaddict.com for Brad's stuff. Brad is at Dowdyism on Twitter and he is penaddict on Instagram. For Dan, you can go to nibsmith.com and he's the nibsmith on Instagram and on Twitter as well. You can find me on imike, I-M-Y-K-E. Thanks to Eero for their support of this week's episode and we'll all be back again next week. So until then, say goodbye, guys. Goodbye, guys. Goodbye, guys.