Editing The Pen Addict 384/transcript (section)

== Estabrook Brand History ==


'''Brad Dowdy:''' Estabrook has been through several cycles of its life. And right now it's in about as good a place as it can be because Kenro has full ownership of the brand full control over the name and is actually getting to design, make, manufacture, and distribute these pens. So we haven't talked about this on the podcast since, like I mentioned before, you weren't quite with Kenro at the time. So can you give us a little bit of background of not really like the acquisition part, but how you decided to make your own pen part?

'''Kerry Yeager:''' Making your own pen. You know, I think it's stemmed way, way back that Kenro dabbled in. Um, they had a company called LaBelle and they were making pens and it was just, you know, kind of getting your feet wet situation and they made it for a while. And I think it was around that time that they had Omos also. So you got Omos, you had Montegrappa, you had Aurora and, you know, there's only so much you can do at one time. And I think after the demise of, of Omos, unfortunately, um, you know, they've been open and looking for the right brand and, you know, part of it, you look at people like, uh, Sid Saperstein who, who has Wall Ebershark and, you know, that's a, a brand that's just iconic and it fell into his lap and he got it. And it just, those things don't happen. So when Estherbrook came around and became available, you know, it was a very, very intriguing offer and a brand that is just known since forever. I mean, it's just, it's like, I believe if I'm correct, it's the fifth U.S. Um, not patent, the fifth U.S. Trademark.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah. Pretty much literally forever. Pretty crazy.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' Pretty much literally forever. Yeah. So it was, you know, a meeting among the minds and what can we do with this brand and how can we develop it and, and Kenro being who they are? I mean, they've been doing it for 27 years and worked with a lot of brands. And like I said, the way we worked with Aurora, Montegrappa, you know, we're constantly developing ideas and what we can do to the market space. And that's pretty much what we did with Estherbrook. You know, what, what can we do to make this brand iconic and literally be reborn? I mean, that's like, that's what we say every day. It's, it's reborn. So what can we do to make that, that live true to, uh, to what we're saying? And when we sat down, it was, and you have to remember that, you know, in our office and I'm not patting anyone's back or saying any bad on anybody, but in our office, we like pens, you know, all of us are, but you know, there are used car sales and it's out there. You know, there really are. There are people that will just make a pen and sell it. And we don't do that. And, and I can say that because I'm there and I live it every day and we go in there with a passion. And I mean, all of us, we sit down at the beginning of the day for an hour and we talk every, every single day about our ideas, our thoughts and different things that we want to do. And that's what we did with the brand was what can we do? What can we do to make this pen? How it should be from the clip to the material, to the shape, to the nib, to the filling systems, you name it. It came up in conversation. And at the time that I came in, I mean, it really wasn't there very long. And I mean, I was there for a reason, you know, I'm a pen nut. And I was brought in very graciously into a very deep situation. And when we took it on and we wanted to see what was going on, the first trade show that was about pens and had manufacturers there was actually in Hong Kong. You have to remember Brian, who was there for 25 years. It's like, you know what? Who's going to go? And it ended up being myself, which I was stunned, Ryan Serrano and Joel. And the three of us went and it was just eye opening to learn so much and be able to, you know, kind of soak it all in. And at the same time, it was hard because you learn the process and that you can have the greatest idea, but you just want to make a pen. It takes time. It takes steps that you can't skip. And when we came home from that trip, I mean, we were really, I mean, every day we were talking, you mean I say we talk for an hour every day, we were talking two and three hours every day. And by the time that SD came out, which believe it or not, it's really only been a year. We released our first pens in Dallas last year. And it feels like it's been five years that we've had the brand and had it out there, but we just celebrated a year of release at Dallas. And it's just, every time we talk about it, we just are shocked at how the brand has done and the strength that it's had and how people have taken to it and the conversations that we get into at pen shows. With customers and end users. Honestly, that pen, that SD, when that came out, we easily spent a thousand hours, I kid you not, conversing. Just sitting down and talking. I don't mean making phone calls. I don't mean through an email. I mean, just us as a group, just talking about what should be done and how it can be done. And you don't realize it, you know, when you see a pen come out, that there might have been a very long process to do so. It's just been an amazing, amazing experience to be able to have my thoughts, my ideas taken as seriously as they were and seeing those ideas actually come to life in a pen that's out there in so many people's hands.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' How important was it to have the nib adapter for old Estabrook nibs at the initial launch of the brand?

'''Kerry Yeager:''' It was everything. You know, the story can go, we'll go like this. When we got Estabrook and we talked about where they are, we looked at brands today that have been around for hundreds, you know, a couple hundred years. So we looked at Waterman specifically as like, where are they now? What does a Waterman look like today? It does not look like the Red Ripple with the pink nib of yesteryear, correct? Sure. Because you can't. And things progress and you move into a modern time and now you've got longer pens, bigger pens, a little bit girthier, yada, yada, yada. So we needed a modern pen for Estabrook. You can carry it every day. It writes all the time. The clip works correctly. You know, we did a cushion cap in it so that it would seal down on top of the nib and make sure that it stayed wet. But where is that connection? Because it had been gone for so long, you know, where is the connection to the past? How do we get to the community and make them understand that we really care about the brand? And that came from us deciding there's got to be a way to get the old J nibs or dollar nibs to fit and work in a modern pen. There has to be a way. Even though it used a lever filler and it never was intended to be used with a cartridge converter. I mean, a cartridge or a converter. And we gave it to four or five designed people and we proposed the idea. And one person figured it out. And, you know, at that time, you know, you're looking at costs and everything. And you have to remember, it's like the money pit, if you will. You're just spending here and spending there because you're developing and you're trying to get ideas out there. And you're just, it's just, it's unbelievable how quickly you can escalate costs on something. And especially when you have a harebrained idea and you say, I want to use this nib and this kind of pen, even though it was never designed to be done. And when we got the first prototype in and we saw how it worked, we were, I was stunned. I really was. And I mean, because you could, we took the old nib and you just put it into this new section and you had the new section fit the new pen. And you capped it. And because we had that cushion closure, it kept that little tiny nib. And most of them are super fine. You know, they, they write really thin lines because they were for dictations a lot in school work.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' They're amazing.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' And it kept them wet. And we would literally keep them capped for two weeks at a time, uncap it, and just like touch the tip of the nib to the paper. And it was like dot, dot, dot. And it would work. And that's just how they work. And it, and it comes down to, you know, back then, you know, that those caps have a breather hole in them. So they would dry out if you didn't use them constantly. And that's just how it is. It's not because it's a bad product. It's just how it was. Now with the cushion closure on that cap that we have on the modern SD, it keeps the vintage nib wet writing all the time. And I have more people come up to me at pen shows, you know, with, I mean, I'm not even going to get into one of the stories, but stories upon stories upon stories about the old nibs that they have from, you know, grandmother, great grandfather. They're ones that they just happened to find at a junk sale and they're using them again. And I love hearing that, you know, it's, you're recycling, if you will. You know, it's kind of a nostalgia thing that flows into that as well.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' From my perspective, I still can't believe it's only been a year. That kind of blew my mind when you said that. But what's happened in this year of since release is that the brand has been able to take over like a spot of its own in the modern pen, you know, sphere that we're in, even though, you know, it's a vintage name brand. And it's built around, yeah, you can use these old nibs, but I think it's become like a standalone product now, at least from my viewpoint to where people are looking for Estabrook. Oh, what is Estabrook doing now? Not to put in, necessarily put in the old nib, even though that's an important story to tell, but that it's looking at, oh, what does the new Estabrook look like? And not considering the nib adapter. Would you say that's fair in the progress you've seen over the past year?

'''Kerry Yeager:''' Absolutely. I absolutely would. Because that is something, you know, that it's specific to that pen. You know, being able to do it to one was a great undertaking. And it's one, like I said, we're so proud of it. You know, I'm proud of it. I can't believe we were able to do that because it gave it a good base. Yeah. Because going forward, there are pens. You know, the next pen that's coming out is the Camden. And it's a metal pen because we wanted something different. You know, we don't want, it's like you said. You don't want people to just associate you as just this group. You know, we want to have that expansion in the brand and be able to do different things and expand, you know, to different demographics of people that want to write. Because if you hit one group of writers, it's great. And you really want to make them happy. But you want to expand. You know, it's like our community. When we go to the same pen shows year after year, you want to see that community grow. And the more different you can have, the more that group will grow because there's more people that are intrigued. Because not everybody's going to like every product you put out. And that's just, say, as somebody who's putting out product and kind of having a lot of input and ideas. And I hear people are like, yeah, that's all right. I mean, I don't know if I would have done that. And I'm just like, really? You know what I battled? You know how many hours I battled at work with everybody to get something, you know? And so that's where, you know, we are definitely expanding. And, you know, the Camden is just one. I mean, there's so many projects that we have working. One that I can't talk about, but I'm sure some people know of a project or are expecting a certain project to come to life eventually. And it is for sure in the works. So, but I can't really say what that is. But all our people out there, they're all going, oh.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' You're as bad a tease as I am. I like it.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' I like it. Believe me. Believe me, I want to tell you. I'm going to tell you so bad.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' It's funny, Carrie, not to, like, tell all of our secrets. But I remember before Estherbrook happened, you would text me just to say, I'm doing a thing and I can't tell you, but I'll tell you at some point. And that would be the extent of the text. And then it'd be like six months before there'd be another text. I'm like, I'm still, that thing is going to happen. And I can't tell you, but when it happens, it's going to be good. But I just want to tell you congratulations and I'm proud of you for what you've put into this. I know it's a labor of love because I know you personally. And I'm just thrilled that this has gone as hopefully as well as you have hoped. And from my perspective, I think it has. But I'm just very, very happy that this has happened for you and for Kenro. And, you know, I hope to continue to see it grow. It's pretty fantastic that y'all have been able to pull this off.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' Thanks. Thanks. I really have to say I appreciate hearing that because we do, we put a lot into it. And, you know, I work with some really incredible people. I am fortunate and I can assure you and the whole audience out there, I really do appreciate and understand and, you know, being, that's one thing about getting older. I've noticed you kind of learn to appreciate things that you normally would just be like, ah, that's cool. But I truly do. I really, I work with great people. I get to do a lot. I get to travel a lot. I get to see, I get to hang out with the community all the time. I mean, my job is being out there with the people, you know, going to a pen show. That's my job. Really? You know, and people will come up to the table and they'd be like, what are you doing? Like, what's new? What's going on? And I'm like, well, you're on your day off visiting the pen show. And I said, I'm working right now, you know? And obviously I say that to our group kind of people and they laugh and they get it. Oh my God, it must be great. And I'm like, you want to know something? Really? I hate to say it, but it is. And, you know, cause I get to play with all the prototypes and all the new stuff that comes in and get to just, you know, the new gochernib comes in and it's like, everyone's like, oh, this is cool. And everyone tries it. And then my job, my job is, you know, Joel's saying, Carrie here, take this home for the weekend and fool around and play with it. And tell me what you think. You know, we, we'll talk about it on Monday. And I'm like, that's my, that's my job. Really? I mean, I can remember blogging and I would just be like, can I just review a Ypsilon please? Oh yes. Yes. And now it's, you know, you're just in it all day long. And, but again, like I said, the point to that was just to say, truly, I am thankful. I really understand how good I have it and being able to do what I love every day as much as I do. It just, it's, it's really, really, it's a great feeling.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Well, I'm going to talk to you next about maybe not feeling so great after all the pen show travel. As much as you love it while you're there, I know how much you travel and I want to dig into that. But first I want to talk about my good friends and your good friends, Carrie Yeager at Pen Chalet. This episode of the pen addict is brought to you by Pen Chalet. They sell authentic, amazing roller balls, fountain pens, ballpoints, mechanical pencils, and so much more. They have all of your favorite brands like Monteverde, Pelican, Lamy, Pilot, Namiki, Sailor and Kaweco, and of course, are an authorized dealer. They have very fast and reliable customer service. They run special discounts twice a month, including closeout specials every two weeks. And they're always adding new styles of pens every single month. As well as the brands I mentioned earlier, Pen Chalet sells limited edition pens and all the pen accessories you ever need. Like pen carrying cases, pen holders, refills, fountain pen converters, and so much more. They have free shipping on orders over $50 in the US, but they also sell international with very reasonable shipping rates. Pen Chalet has low prices on high quality pens and offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee. So go to PenChalet.com, click on the podcast link at the top of the website, enter the password PENADDICT for this week's special offer. And to get the code, you need to save 10% on anything at Pen Chalet. So our bit on the podcast carry is I don't get to look at these offers ahead of time. So I just rolled into the Pen Chalet site. I clicked the radio podcast button, put in the code PENADDICT, and found a crazy deal on the Platinum 3776, which is a fantastic pen. One I brag about all the time. I think it's a fantastic writer. It's a crazy good price. And secondly, and I'm pretty sure Ron didn't know you're coming on this week. The second item in my list is a free Estabrook 25-ounce stainless steel bottle with any purchase of the Estabrook SD, the Estabrook SD Oversize, or the Estabrook SD SE. I swear to you, this was not planned because Ron wouldn't have known you were going to be my guest this week. So that's pretty funny. So y'all should head over to Pen Chalet, check out all the deals, check out their wonderful selection of products this week. And thanks so much to Pen Chalet for sponsoring Relay FM and Pen Addict. Tell me about this water bottle. You gave me this water bottle. Whose idea was this? It's pretty cool. It's a fancy Estabrook water bottle.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' It is. And it's a water bottle. It looks like it has stickers. And they're actually printed on there. So you can wash it and they don't come off. But we also left a room so you can put your own stickers on there too. You can put more on there. Feel free. Never enough stickers. Never enough stickers. Bottom of the laptop, top of the laptop, you move on to the phone. So that idea was Brian, Brian Holzer, who's our vice president.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' No way.

'''Kerry Yeager:''' And you see, that's the thing. Everybody in our company has like a little specialty. And that's why sometimes the conversations, honestly, they go more than an hour. They'll go two hours because everyone's got a different thought and puts it into the process. Brian is like that creative guy. And he constantly comes up with new ways to engage. And the water bottle, you know, you walk around and he's like, I see water bottles everywhere. Everybody's got a water bottle. Nobody wants to, you know, throw away the plastic. We should make a water bottle with our name on it. And, you know, really? Yeah. And then two days go by and he's got a layout of what one should look like and how it should look. And you know what? We could even put like a logo from one of the stores and we'll figure out how to balance everything out so they can just give it away. That's crazy. You know, sometimes you hear that and, you know, Joel will try and rope us back in and say, guys, you can't give away the world, you know? And, you know, he always, he tries to keep us at bay and he does a great job at doing that. But yeah, so we did a water bottle and we figured it out. We navigated the whole situation. And it's awesome. It's just awesome to be able to have it out there. And it's another way to have our brand in people's face saying, look, here's something cool. Here's something that, you know, the community uses. A lot of people in our community use this. And we know that because we are constantly, you know, with them. You know, we're constantly with our people, listening to what they want, seeing what they do, how they journal, how they write, what they're traveling with. And, you know, it makes an impact. It really does. And I see him now when I see him, like I was at Ohio last weekend, and I saw a couple of people and they had him, you know, tucked into the side of the backpack. And I'm like, I know that. I know that water bottle. And, you know, it's really cool to see stuff like that. So Ron was one of the people that took that on and he's got it as his special.