The Pen Addict 306/transcript

The Pen Addict Podcast Transcript
Episode:	306
Title:	Pen...cil
Release Date:	May 2nd, 2018
Hosts:	Brad Dowdy Myke Hurley
Guests:	No guests this episode
Additional Information
Official page:	Episode 306
Audio File:	Audio Episode 306
Podcast page:	The Pen Addict 306
Length:	5757 min <br />0.95 h <br /> minutes
Previous Transcript	Next Transcript

Brad Dowdy: From RelayFM, this is The Pen Addict, episode 306. Today's show is brought to you by Casper and Storyworth. My name is Myke Hurley. I am joined by Mr. Brad Dowdy. Hello, Myke Hurley. Hi, how are you? Good. How's things going? Very well, my friend. Very well, indeed. We have a lot of stuff to go through today. I've been a little bit traumatised on Instagram.

Myke Hurley: So, you put this link in the show notes, and we're going to talk about this link in one second. But I would like to say, I had no idea what this was before I clicked it. So, why don't you drive this one home here?

Bung Box Instagram

Brad Dowdy: I made a mistake in following the Bung Box Instagram account. I feel like that, really, that was probably a mistake for me. Because they post these, like, images of all of the limited edition Sailor pens that they do. And I want to buy them all. They have one, which is a Tokyo Metro 90th Anniversary Founting Pen, which is a yellow Sailor Pro Gear Rialo. And there are two different pens you can buy, from what I can understand. One has, like, a Raden finial. And the other has, like, the letter G, which, from what also what I can understand, is, like, a logo from the Tokyo Metro. It's, like, one of the, like, lines, I think. It's, like, maybe, like, the G line or something like that. That's kind of what I can grok. Again, as of all of this, like, there is so much of the Bung Box website that cannot be translated, right, by, like, Google. Because they use a lot of images and stuff. So a lot of it is kind of just, like, what I can work out. Which, honestly, also makes it a little bit more exciting. You know? And I kind of like that a lot. The other pen is a green pen, which has a most, like, it's a demonstrator body, but the grip section and the cap are, like, green with some little flecks in it, like the pink love, like the little glitter in it. These are both beautiful. And I want them both. Also, the green one has the ink tells more nib, like the pink love does. But here's the thing, Brad. I'm not going to buy either of them. Because.

Myke Hurley: I mean, we just had this discussion last week about the FOMO, Myke.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I know. I know. I love both of these. But the thing is, I can't keep doing it because I will buy all of them. Like, so. Right. I really like the look of both of these pens a lot, but I am not going wild for them like I did the pink love. Like, that was a pen that I had to have. Right. And so, like, if I was at a pen show and this, like, Tokyo Metro 90th anniversary was there and I picked it up, I would be like, I'm walking away with this. But for me to buy this pen, as I have learned, it is a stressful experience to get one of these, right? Because there's so much going on with it. So, I'm deciding to not go through this again until there is a really, really good reason for me to do so. And as much as I love both of these pens, I'm not going to do that. But I also feel like, ultimately, it was a mistake for me to follow this account because I feel like it's going to be expensive for me in the long run.

Myke Hurley: Well, it's the right thing to do. You should follow them because this stuff's awesome. You're finding it. It is so good. And like you mentioned in the show doc, if they came out with, like, a quarterly Sailor subscription. See, that's what I want, right? You would fall over.

Brad Dowdy: I want to just give them $200. You know, I give them, like, $800 a year, right? And they just send me a pen every quarter. And then it will just come to me and I'll be happy and then there's no stress. Because here's the thing, right? This is probably the good thing slash the problem. If this website was, like, completely in English and I could just buy it, I would probably buy both of these pens. Right? But it's a good thing in that it is more difficult for me. So, it's saving me the money.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. Yeah. All right. So, I have a few things to say here. One, Bung Box was in New York for the Long Island Pen Show like a week and a half ago. Dang. So, I saw some pictures. I saw Carrie in one of their pictures. And they had the Tokyo Metro ink line up there, which I think is a really neat little setup. It's like a box of nine inks. I saw that on the table. I don't know if they brought these pens there. Maybe someone went. We'll see. So, that would have been your pen show opportunity, you know. They don't go to many shows. And I actually picked up two of their limited editions. Or actually, Jeff picked up one. I picked up the other one. So, this yellow one that you like, the G line, that's based off the Soleil that they did about four years ago, three or four years ago. It's amazing. It's a beautiful pen. They had it at the DC Pen Show the first time that they came there. Jeff bought that one that I bought actually in the banner image on that Ginza line.

Myke Hurley: Train. Oh, train. Train line. Ginza line page is a blue Pilot Custom 74. I forget which model this is. It's got these blue sparkles. I haven't really seen that. That's the one I bought. I don't use that pen enough. It's a 91. Excuse me. It's a 91. That's a beautiful pen. I have that one. So, that said, this, I'm going to butcher this name. I'm going to go for it here. You ready?

Myke Hurley: Suyukari? Suyukari? There's probably something I'm not supposed to say there.

Brad Dowdy: You're a braver man than me.

Myke Hurley: So, I love this pen. I'm not going to buy this pen. But I have this ink. This is one of my favorite ink. I think it translates to like light pea soup or something like that. It matches this pen. So, that's the bottle of ink that they're selling with it. I've had this ink for, I don't know, a year or two. I really, really enjoy it. I don't like the eyeball finial. That's a little creepy. I don't know what's going on there. If anyone would like care to explain that to me.

Brad Dowdy: Did you say it's an eyeball? I thought it was a leaf.

Myke Hurley: The big picture, it looks like a cat's eye. I guess if you get up close, it makes more sense that it's a leaf. But from the long view, it's looking like an eyeball. Oh, it's totally a leaf, man.

Brad Dowdy: You can see like the little line in it.

Myke Hurley: It looks like a leaf to me. I see it now, but that's a cat's eye to me.

Brad Dowdy: See, now I couldn't buy it because now I'd see an eyeball.

Myke Hurley: Mm-hmm. It's watching you, Myke. Oh, no. I'm watching you. So, yes, follow Bung Box at your own risk. We've known this for years. It is known, Myke, that you should watch your wallet whenever Bung Box is involved, especially if you're a Sailor fan. And so, yeah, I am glad you brought these to my attention so I could see their beauty and not purchase them. So, there you have it. And it's not going to stop. You know that, right?

Pink Love Pen

Brad Dowdy: Oh, I know. I know. But it gives me hope in that there will be at some point something else that I will buy and I will be willing to put myself through mostly just the emotional turmoil of buying. But, you know, I feel like I'm ruining myself at the same time because I've allowed this to happen.

Myke Hurley: You landed your white whale in the pink love. I did. You're very satisfied. Very satisfied. There's no need to rush into anything else, like you said. And, Myke, there will always be a next time. There will always be a next pen. There will always be a next ink. There will always be a next notebook. So, yeah.

Brad Dowdy: I think it's a nice way, like with last week, this is me letting go of the FOMO. Just letting go of it. I'm going to miss out on this one. It's fine.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. There will always be a next time, especially from Bung Box.

Brad Dowdy: Because I missed out on the original pink love and it came back to me. You know, if you love a pen, let it out into the world. And if it loves you back, it will return. You know? I want to talk about the Y Studio Mechanical Pencil. You wrote a review about this pencil recently. Because I'm really keen to understand. I was really keen to understand how you felt about it. I read the review. And now I want to talk through some of that with you. Because I know that you are a huge fan of the pen that they do. The fountain pen, right? Which is a very, very beautiful thing.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. It's called the Brassing Fountain Pen. Which, in writing this review, I learned that I've never actually done a proper review of the Brassing Fountain Pen. I've reviewed the desk pen, which I love. But it's one of those pens I end up using so much that I just think I've written about it. And when I actually haven't, when I went to go back to link the review, I realized there was no review to link to. So I will correct that soon because I love that pen.

Mechanical Pencil

Brad Dowdy: So what makes this pencil different to what is currently available in the marketplace?

Myke Hurley: Mostly the size and shape and design and appearance of the pencil. It's a large mechanical pencil made from brass, which is shockingly not as heavy as you would think. They have thinned this out appropriately so it's not an overbearing weight. A lot of fountain pens we've used in the circles we run in, like from Karis Customs or Nomisu or there's been a few. Pretty much any company that's made a metal pen, Tactile Turn has made brass models. And they're just outrageously heavy. This is not a heavy pencil. And the style of it is just stunning, right? You look at it and you go, wow, they really knock it out of the park. And being a fan of Y Studio like I am, I fully expected that to be the case, that this is just a wonderful, wonderful looking pencil. And I love the copper knock on the end of the brass pencil. That's like really, really good looking.

Brad Dowdy: I would not have thought that brass and copper would look good together, right? But it does. It actually really does with this. But I think maybe the bigger story here is what's wrong with this? Like what is this pencil lacking? Because I think something that probably surprised the both of us, you didn't really seem to like it that much.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. So I would have, I got this pen on loan or pencil on loan from Van S Pens. And if I didn't get that for review, I probably would have just bought it like sight unseen, right? Like I love Y Studio, I would not have considered the things that I ended up finding out about this pencil that I didn't like in retrospect. I would have jumped at buying this if, you know, all things considered, if I didn't have a review unit of it. So what I found real quick on this pen, pencil, God, I'm going to keep doing that the entire show, aren't I? I always, I always do that, is for a wide barreled pen.

Brad Dowdy: Soul.

Myke Hurley: Soul. I'll fix it for you. Don't worry. I've got you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. It's not comfortable to write with a fine tip. So the wider your fingers are, the wider the tip needs to be.

Brad Dowdy: It's too much of a harsh change, right? Because it really goes down to, obviously, a super fine mechanical pencil lead. Yeah, it's 0.7 millimeter. Right. But compared to the hot dog you're holding in your hand, right, like that is a very, you know, that's a very different scenario. Like what's actually being output is vastly different. And I can imagine, especially with the weight of this thing, maybe it doesn't stack up very well to be a pencil.

Myke Hurley: Right. So it feels weird making small marks with such a large pencil, right? It's like, I don't know, it's like you're holding a log and, you know, trying to write like a math equation, you know, in a graph sheet of paper. So it's a little bit uncomfortable. It would be the perfect size. If they made this a clutch pencil that holds like the 2.0 millimeter leads and you use larger, wider strokes, it's more for drawing and sketching. That would be like the perfect use for this barrel. The other thing I found, which again, I did not realize this, like it didn't even cross my mind, would have never crossed my mind before I bought this pencil. Was that the hex barrel in a mechanical pencil doesn't work well because you have to rotate the pencil when you're writing. So everyone does this and they don't realize they do it because it's just such a natural habit. When you're using any type of pencil, wood case or mechanical, you're always writing a few letters, the twisting the pen in your hand. It's just like a natural motion. The pencil. Damn it, Myke, you didn't fix it there. Sorry. So you have this motion to where you write a few letters, twist, write a few letters, twist to always keep the sharp edge of the graphite going in the pencil, right? It's like, it's just a natural thing. And I talked about how the Uniball Curitoga, it's so popular because it corrected that. Like if you don't want to twist the pencil in your hands, the Uniball Curitoga will just rotate it for you. So the reason why it's an issue on this pencil is the width of the barrel gives it a wide, I don't know, wide hex dimensions, if you will, the flat parts. So when you twist and that hex shape runs all the way through the gripping area of the pencil and you rotate like very frequently, like every second or two, you're rotating, you know, just as you write, you just don't even realize you're doing it. I end up on top of the hex, like on the ridge and I, you, your grip is not solid then. So I have to stop, get on the flat part and then keep writing. And it would just happen over and over again. I was like, it's, it's like too much, even that we're talking like microseconds, it's destroying like my flow because I'm, I'm, I'm twisting. And then I hit a spot where I have less of a grip on the pencil than I did a split second ago when I was fully in the flat. So I didn't realize how much of an issue that would be because we've all used regular wooden pencils in the past and all of those are hex barrels. Why isn't that an issue? Well, it's because one, they're narrower. Your fingers cover more ground on those pencils. You're probably on the ridge to begin with. And those, those ridges are generally more rounded off. So you'll notice that not a lot, no, you know, wooden pencils, you don't notice that as much as you're twisting them while you're writing. But with this pen, it really stood out just because of the size and it ended up being uncomfortable and it was not something I expected. So there's a few pencils that are made this way, but 99% of the mechanical pencils, you go look, let's just look at the rotary, you know, hex barrel, round grip, everything, any popular mechanical pencil that has a hex barrel morphs into a round grip of some kind. And there's a reason for that. It's because it's actually uncomfortable to write with, which I wouldn't have, I didn't pick up on before I bought it. Like, I mean, before I got this on loan, I would have totally bought this pencil just because I love it. Love the brand. But functionally, it did not work for those reasons.

Brad Dowdy: I just want to say before we run this out, there is a picture that you put in this article of the rotary sitting atop the Y Studio pencil. It is so beautiful. Like, I had to look at it for a while. I was like, is this like, at first it looked like it was like a painting or something. Like, I was looking at it and I was like, what's going on here? Like, there's something about this image. I absolutely love it. It's very good, Brad. You did a good job.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, I lucked into that one. And I mean, I knew what I wanted to do. My idea was I wanted to, I was trying to show how much wider the Y Studio pencil is compared to a standard pencil. And there's no better standard mechanical pencil than the Rotring 600. So I was able to sit it right on top. And I, you know, I didn't put this down specifically, but it's almost two millimeters wider. I'll have to look at the, I did it in my write-up and then I forgot to transfer it. You can really see it though.

Brad Dowdy: Like, it's really, really clear to see it. Yeah.

Myke Hurley: So like, when you look at like the numbers on a page, you're like, oh, like a millimeter is not that big of a difference. But when you're holding it in your hand, it's a gigantic difference. So when my wife saw this picture, she thought that the Y Studio pencil was cut open and that was the interior. You know, that was like the insides of the bottom pencil showing through on the top. So now that I see that, I was like, man, that's a totally weird picture, but it came out really good. And it did exactly what I wanted it to do. It just showed how a small difference in grip section width can make a huge difference in your writing experience. There are cases where wide barrels are good. You know, like I talked about it in the post where like, if you have hand issues or arthritis and you can't really have these fine motor skill motions, you know, you need a wider grip. But correspondingly, you get a wider tip to write with besides a 0.7 millimeter pencil. So I was surprised a little bit on this one. I thought this was going to be just like a lock, one of my favorite things. And it turns out like it's really not. And it took me to use this pencil for a while. I realized it pretty quick when I was rotating it, that it was going to drive me crazy the way I rotated it in my hand and kept landing on these ridges and then had to move again to continue writing. I was like that, that double, that double stop in between letters was super frustrating. So it was a good review for that aspect from a learning aspect. So I have really enjoyed this review. I got some kind words on this review, just saying, you know, thanks for like breaking it down in that way, other than just like a, like a spec thing. You know, that's what I'm, I'm trying to do more of and, and, and relate it, relate it to like actual usage. And I found that, that I love this, the looks of this pencil, but I don't love using it. So there you have it.

StoryWorth

Brad Dowdy: All right. This episode is brought to you by StoryWorth, the easiest way to share your family stories. StoryWorth makes it easy and enjoyable for your loved ones to share their life stories with weekly email story prompts and questions that you might not think to ask on your own. Then at the end of the year, they'll get their stories bound in a beautiful hardcover book. It's sleek with a black and white interior color cover and up to 480 pages in length. This means that you and your loved ones can preserve the memories and even pass this on to future generations. Here's how StoryWorth works. You buy a subscription for someone important to you, and then each week, StoryWorth will send them an email with a question about their life. Then they can email back with their story or even record it over the phone and it will be turned into text. After a year, their stories will be bound in that beautiful book for them to keep. StoryWorth is a great way to learn more about someone. The questions are designed to evoke entertaining, surprising, and moving responses. And StoryWorth is also a great way of staying in touch with family members who maybe live a little further away than you'd like. With StoryWorth, you can write stories and upload photos by email, on the web, or in their smartphone app as well. You can also share their stories with as many people as you want. You just invite them by email. And then you can save and edit all of these stories on StoryWorth.com. All of your data is secure and everything is private by default. You get to control exactly who sees what. I've been trying out StoryWorth. And one of the questions that I saw when I was looking through this with a family member was about family vacations. And I remember, and something that I know that I'm going to see in my responses to this is about all of the vacations that we used to take as kids to seaside towns in England. We used to go to lots of seaside towns by the coast. And you know where video games are playing, like arcades or whatever? Yeah. We call them amusement arcades, which is shortened to amusements. So they were called the amusements. And so that's going to be, that's a fun thing. And we're going to hear lots about amusements and donuts and fish and chips, which is a lot about my life as a kid. Nice. And for my family, StoryWorth is great because it's not that we're spread out. It's that we actually just don't get a lot of time together. So I understand like this is a great thing for people and families can't get together that often because they're far away. But some people, they're just busy. And this is a great way to stay connected and to share something. So if you're looking for a meaningful, maybe even last minute, Mother's Day gift. So it's perfect for this. This is absolutely perfect for someone you care about, especially for Mother's Day. And now is the time to place your order. Listeners of this show can get $20 off their subscription by going to storyworth.com slash penaddict. That is $20 off when you visit storyworth.com slash penaddict. StoryWorth, a new way to bring the family together. Our thanks to them for their support of this show and RelayFM.

Myke Hurley: So it's funny how this next topic actually ties into the previous topic.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, especially in design. The Kaweco grip, the Apple Pencil grip, it appears that it is going to be making its way to the U.S. soon, right? This is something that you sent to me. You sent me an image. Where did this come from?

Myke Hurley: Yes, I'm on their Kaweco's PR mailing list. You know, I'm sure a bunch of people are. Actually, I know a bunch of people are because they forget to BCC everyone sometimes. So that's cool. They sent out this most recent one and put an availability date on that, which I'm guessing is the European availability date, which I think was April. And that means that they're coming to main retailers around the world probably shortly after that. So I would look for these late spring, early summer. They're going to be available.

Brad Dowdy: It is so hard to buy right now. I've just gone to Most Wanted Pens. Delivery time, 80 workdays. Wow.

Myke Hurley: I'm going to start putting my things in workdays.

Brad Dowdy: Now, you know, so that's on the black and silver. On the gold is one to four days. And the rose gold is 80. So if you want one soon, you know, the rose gold, the actual gold one is the one you want. They've got that in stock. Everything else is heavily backordered.

Myke Hurley: Like, yeah, this is going to be we've talked about this from the minute we saw this. If this ever becomes wide release, it's going to do really well outside of our community. Right. I mean, this is a big accessory item for Apple and it's so well done. It's going to fit right in. So I got to try yours in Atlanta. I got to see one in the Arkansas Pen Show. I'm definitely picking one of these up. I don't know that I'm going to use it constantly. I like the thinness of the Apple Pencil, which goes back to the Y Studio stuff. When I'm using my Apple Pencil, it's generally smaller writing. And there's definitely a correlation between wide barrels and wide writing and small barrels and small writing. So we'll see. I'll get one to try. But at least they rounded the grip right. Hex barrel knurled round grip. So that's the way you do it.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I'm a big fan. I really like it. I have two now. I have one on each of my Apple Pencils. Because it was a thing that I liked so much that I wanted to keep, right? Like I liked it a lot. So I wanted to keep it on there. And that meant that I would want it on both. Because I don't want to be... I mean, the reason I have two Apple Pencils is so I don't have to keep swapping around between my two iPads. Like it's just never an issue. There's always one attached. I'm never going to forget it. So I decided to just go ahead and get it. And I also got it in just before the availability changed horrifically. And I'm not going to say it's my fault that the availability changed. But I'm also going to say that it was fine to get. And then I spoke about it on a couple of my shows. And then like a week later, they were completely sold out everywhere. I'm just... I'm not going to say I had anything to do with it, Kaweco. But like you never know, right?

Myke Hurley: Never know. Never know. But I think this is one of those things where I will get and I will end up going back and forth in the beginning. Then it'll end up sticking like full time on my pencil. Plus, I tend to lose my Apple Pencil.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, it took me some time as well to like just get used to having it.

Myke Hurley: So I lose my Apple Pencil. I think I lost my one for like five days like recently. And I finally found... Remembered where it was. So I think being this larger size will help it not, you know, disappear on me as randomly as it currently does. Because I do tend to lose my Apple Pencil because I don't hook it to my case like you do.

Pen Turning

Brad Dowdy: No. And I do that with a Leuchton 1917 pen loop in case you're interested in that. So a few weeks ago, we spoke about making pens, like about how you go about making pens. And you mentioned you'd been getting some responses in and we're going to talk about those today. So do you want to go through what we've seen from this?

Myke Hurley: Yeah, so I got several emails on this. I want to bring two of them here to the show. And Brian from Red Dragon Pen Co., also known as Chewbacca in the chat room and on Slack, has started making pens, I guess, in the last year. Maybe a little bit longer. Correct me if I'm wrong, Brian, whenever you get a chance. But he nailed down the high-level overview for what is needed to jump into making custom pens. So this is a list of what he says are the minimum things. And then I have, so I'll read his email. Then I have a second email, a wonderful follow-up from Emmanuel, which we'll piggyback on to Brian's email. But let me go through this first because I know several people were very interested in this topic. And I wanted to make sure, since we got some great responses from people that are getting started in making pens, that we wanted to share these out there with you. So Brian's list, a lathe, which I think that's probably number one on any list for making pens. A wood lathe will be much less expensive than a metalworking lathe, but certain things will be more difficult. So that's something you'd have to shop for, deciding, you know, what type of effort you want to make in there. Something to hold the workpiece, chucks, centers, etc. Something to cut the material with, chisels, carbide tools. Something to bore out the inside of the pens, drill bits. Taps and dies for making threads. At a minimum, you need threads for the nib unit. Section to body threading and body to cap threading. And sanding and polishing stuff. Grits from 120 up through micro mesh for polishing to a high shine. So before I read the rest of his email, I'm going to stop right there. I'm like super intimidated already. I don't know about you.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, there's a lot going on here, right? Like, and there's a lot of terms that I actually don't fully understand.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, like I'm scared. I'm scared of tools. I'm not a handyman. So this would be like a disaster for me to attempt. But I understand all the parts and pieces that he's talking. So, you know, the lathe is going to hold it to turn. And then you're going to have different, basically, parts to, you know, modify the barrel as it's turning. Whether the exterior or the interior of that barrel. Then you're going to have to make threads on that barrel. And then you're going to have to make it look pretty. So, yeah. That's just, and that's the simple stuff. Right? That's just, that's like, I mean, not the simple stuff. But like, that's the main, the majority of the work. So, he also says a good set of calipers is also pretty important. Because a lot of measurements need to be pretty precise. For instance, when cutting the 10 on, which I don't even know what that is. For the section to thread into the body. So, that connection there from your grip section into the body. I need it to be 9.9 millimeters. If you are at 10.1 millimeters and try to cut the threads. You probably won't be able to even get the die to engage and start the threads. If you make it too small and end up with 9.6 millimeters. It'll be too loose. And you might as well start the section all over. Because the threads won't be strong enough to provide a tight seal. So, Brian and I'm sure a lot of people getting into pin turning and starting these things. The amount of practice and the amount of waste that they have in learning their trade has got to be enormous. This is a very time-consuming, detailed work. That we're fascinated by it because it's so impressive. The end result, right? So, we see these things. The end result that you and I are buying. But the process it took to get there is kind of outrageous if you think about it. Right? It's wild. I mean, what do you think about this?

Brad Dowdy: It really seems so hard. It's just so much, right? And I know that, like, with anything, like, because we have no idea. But once you get good at it, it becomes second nature. Like, in the same way that, like, if I tried to explain to you right now all the steps that it takes for me to edit and publish the show. It's like, if you've never done that before, like, what on earth is happening? Right? Because it's, like, it's skills and experience that make it possible. But when you look at it just like this, it's like, well, I have no idea where to begin. You've told me where to begin, but I don't know how to begin.

Myke Hurley: So, we're going to talk about that in the next email. But I'm working with Brian. I'm in the queue, but I owe him some material to make my pen from. And I told him I was going to look at these couple of pen shows that I had been to since I got on his list. And I haven't found anything that has totally jumped out to me. But he gave me some places online to look at. So, I need to get Brian my rod soon.

Brad Dowdy: Mm-hmm.

Myke Hurley: Mm-hmm. So, I'll be working on that. And I've picked a nice rod out, Myke. It's very pretty. Good. So, I'm going to work on that soon. So, Emmanuel breaks it down a little bit more. And we're going to cut to the chase with Emmanuel's email because he gives me a number. His TLDR is, it's about $1,000 to start out. So, that's our jumping in point if you want to start this out into this event. So, like Brian's email, he says, to make pens, you need a lathe, tools, pen, mandrel, pen kits. Cheap lathe can be had for $300. You can find some used ones there. He gives out some recommendations. If you're wondering, y'all can email me or tweet at me. I'll get you some of the recommendations. You know, he goes through, like, the drill presses and, you know, a few other prices. So, like, $300 for a lathe, $500 to $600 for a drill press. And that's just for, like, a little bit of hardware. Then you have to buy all the blanks, you know, all the nibs, the materials. You know, just the making threads part before you even make these pens to ensure, like Brian said, the tolerances. That just stretches me out even thinking about it, right? Like, I don't understand how the, that you guys make this stuff work. But you clearly do. You're the pros. That's why I'm glad to sort this out. But, so, you know, Emmanuel is saying the custom work. It says, you know, he's buying a lot of acrylics from other people. That gets costly. You know, a lot of people mix aluminite themselves because it's easier to mix. But then you have to have, you know, pressure pots and vacuum chambers to do. If you're making your own acrylics, like, that's why I'm providing materials to Brian to get my, pen made. But, yeah, if you're, if you're getting into this game, it's not, it's not just like a fly by the seat of your pants type of thing. It's, it's definitely something that you really need to consider. Think about, Emmanuel talks about how he, his hobbies were already like construction and tool base. So, he has a lot of stuff. Yeah. Yeah. His, he has a lot of the things to get started. But, you know, it's a, it's an interesting thing. And we're seeing more and more of it for people that are, you know, inclined to work with their hands and work with tools and have that type of detailed work. I think this is a fascinating thing to get into. Honestly, like the, like the getting in point, like dollars wise, doesn't intimidate me, but actually ruining everything I touch for like six months would intimidate me for a while. Right?

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Oh, for sure.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. So, like at the end of a hard day's pen turning, I need to sleep well. And do you have something that, you know, I could sleep on that would give me a good night's sleep and rested and refreshed to get up and make a whole new batch of pens the next day, Myke? I need my rest. How can I get it?

Casper Mattresses

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Myke Hurley: Especially where I live. And this is the thing that has impressed me the most about Casper. And I don't want to just pin it to warmer areas, but it is the coolest temperature-wise mattress I have ever slept on. That's an important thing to me. I don't like to be hot when I sleep. And living in the southeastern United States, it's hot nine months out of the year. So knowing going to bed and not have to dread the fact that you're going to have a rough night because you can't ever get your temperature regulated. Casper handles that, like, I don't know, whatever magic they use to make these mattresses. It works out great for me. It's always cool and comfortable and gives me a great night.

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Myke Hurley: So I'm leading off this section of Ask TPA with my new favorite type of question. And I'm also leading it off with an apology to Lydia because this has been in my inbox for like two or three weeks now. I told her I'd answer it. But I love doing this. And this is the response from the green truck we were trying to match a few weeks ago. We're talking about trucks again. We're not talking about trucks as much as we love trucks. We're talking about uniforms and park ranger uniforms specifically. So I absolutely. That's good to me. Yeah, I love. I love everything about this email. So let me read this email. I just finished listening to episode 302 in which you seem to have a lot of fun finding the matching pen and ink to Jeff's truck. Well, I have a similar challenge for you. Can you find a pen and ink to match my work uniform? So the lead in is perfect, but the details are what I love when people obsess over things like finding a pen to match your uniform. So let me continue. I'm a park ranger, so I need something that is durable and preferably not too expensive. But I do have a preference for fountain pens. The trick is finding something that not only looks good with the uniform, but fits in the pen slot on the breast pocket. The sizes vary on all my shirts, usually hovering around 2 to 2.5 centimeters, but the narrowest opening is 1.5 centimeters. I will attach some pictures of the uniform and a close-up of the smallest pen slot. Notes about the pictures. The shirt in back is a class B and was included because the tan color is lighter than the class A, though it did not come up well in the image. I also wear a silver nameplate with black lettering that was not included in the picture. I enjoy listening to your podcast on my way to work and wish you safe travels to all your pen shows, Lydia. How amazing is that? So cool. So not only does Lydia have a cool job, she's super obsessive about the uniform and wants a pen to match it. Like this is everything I want in an app TPA, right?

Brad Dowdy: Do you know, Brad, if it is okay for me to share the image of this uniform?

Myke Hurley: I do not know. I did not ask her. Okay.

Brad Dowdy: I'm going to go with, we won't do it, and maybe if it's cool, Lydia can follow up with us. How about that?

Myke Hurley: Yeah. Yeah. So a lot of people can probably picture a park ranger uniform, you know, tan shirts, green pants, or I'm sure some have, you know, full khaki uniforms, but you know the range. You know the ranger range? The ranger range. So the ranger range of uniforms is a wonderful range. That was a good job by you. So what I couldn't get out of my head when I was trying to figure this out was she needs a brass pen. Like the brass pen is like perfect for this. The problem is there's not a great brass fountain pen that is cost effective and would work with the shirt pocket clips. Like a Kaweco brass sport is a great pocket pen. It's not great with its clip in the shirt pocket, and it's probably a little bit wide, and it's a little bit expensive. You know? So like I was having a real hang up on like she needs a brass pen. She needs a brass pen. But then it hit me like there's two really actually good easy options. The first one I thought of was the Platinum Plaisir, honestly, because it's a metal barrel. It's thin aluminum. It's not maybe as durable as the second one I'm going to mention, which is actually probably pretty obvious when it gets down to it. But I thought the Plaisir might work because something like their orange barrel would look nice with the tan and green. It would fit in the pockets because I've checked the measurements. Even the smallest pocket, it's narrower than the smallest pocket. It's got nice hardware. It's very good looking. I think the only kicker is it is a little bit light, and it's not as durable as probably my second option, which of all things, I'm kind of shocked that I think the Pilot Metropolitan might be perfect. So I put some links to both the Plaisir and the standard color Metropolitans, which are black, silver, and gold. Like the gold Metropolitan would look super good on this uniform. It's inexpensive. It's a fountain pen. It's going to take a beating in the field. Once I stuck on these two pens, I had a hard time coming up with something else because I kind of think it's the right answer. But I'm overly excited about finding Lydia the perfect pen for her uniform and her day-to-day work. So if you have any other suggestions or if anyone that listens to the show has any other suggestions, y'all can get in touch with us and let us know what your recommendations are. But yeah, I kind of think that's the way to go. Do you have any thoughts?

Brad Dowdy: I mean, I can't pick any better than you in this one. I think you've done a fantastic job. Because any picks that I make, I definitely will not be making the measurements for them. So, you know, nowhere near as thorough as your research there, my friend.

Myke Hurley: And I was really hung up on it for a little bit. It's like, I got to find something brass. And they just didn't, you know, meet the requirements that were needed. And then the Plaisir hit me. If you want something for like in a standout color, like an orange or a purple. And then for the traditional look, the classic Metropolitans in black, silver or gold, I think are kind of the perfect fit. To meet the fountain pen criteria, the durable criteria and the price point criteria. I think that's the way to go. So, very cool. Thank you, Lydia. And keep those questions coming. If anyone needs us to match anything to their uniforms, to their cars, to their pets. I don't know. What else can we do, Myke? What else can we do?

Brad Dowdy: Some kind of like, I don't know, like buildings. You know, maybe you have like a pink house, right? And you want a pink pen for the pink house. We could do that.

Myke Hurley: Okay. Yeah. So, we do these things here. Whenever you need. So, we will match up. Yeah. We'll match.

Brad Dowdy: It's the service we provide for free.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. That's exactly right. All right. These other ass TPAs. Let's get to them. First one via Patrick. Just wondering if you have a recommendation as to what micromesh to buy, especially for someone like me who's never used it before. Also, any recommendations about using micromesh in general? Relatedly, are the Goulet pen cleaning and cleaning tuning kits a good value for what you get? So, this is a good question. Because I use a couple of things regularly in my cleaning, repairing, tuning setup. And number one is probably micromesh. What you want to buy is called 12,000 grit micromesh. It's the finest, safest micromesh to use. That's if you're just trying to knock an edge off a nib, make it a smoother writer. You want 12,000. You don't want any like more coarse grits because then you'll start actually modifying the shape of the nib. Yep. If you use it too heavily. So, you want to start with advice.

Brad Dowdy: And you say like you want some advice for using micromesh. The advice is carefully.

Myke Hurley: Yes, carefully. So, you can modify the shape of your pen. Some people will reshape a nib with micromesh. It can be done with the right grit and the right pressure. But if you just want to smooth out a pen, which is what I generally want. Like, I get a pen, like say a stub nib. It might have a little tick in the nib when I write in one particular direction. I'll get out the finest micromesh, which I have. It's a little 12,000 grit pad. You put a droplet of water or two or three drops of water on that pad. It'll hold it up. And I start drawing like figure eights or infinity symbols. So, you just kind of go in circles, making some shapes, light pressure. You're not jamming on the pen and the pad really hard. You're just doing it very lightly just so you can feel it. You know, do five or ten in a vertical infinity pattern. And I'll do five or ten loops in a horizontal infinity pattern. And I'm making the motions as I talk to you, Myke. Do you know what?

Brad Dowdy: I can hear you doing it.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, because my pacing slowed down when I was talking because I was having to think more. So, you know, and that water gives you the ability to move the nib around smoothly. And you still get the effects of the grit. So, do that like five or ten times each direction. Dry it off and then test it out on a piece of paper right next to you. And see how it flows. See if it's different. And, you know, see if it improved what you want. Then you can do it a little bit more if you need a little bit more. So, it's a slow and steady thing. And it actually doesn't take too much. So, anytime I've ever had to, you know, kind of tune a pen to make it smoother. It's a pretty quick thing. You know, just like a minute or two of taking your time going through some loops on your grit pad. And, yeah, that's a really good thing. So, the cleaning and tuning kits, I guess every site is probably different in what they offer. Besides micromesh, the thing I use the most are the brass sheets. Because I use very fine and extra fine nibs. I like those little shims to go between the tines. And sometimes they get out paper fibers in there. That's kind of the next thing I use the most. I do use silicone grease when I eye dropper. And I do use syringes for when I fill and clean pens. So, those are my main cleaning and tuning items.

Pen Flush

Brad Dowdy: How about pen flush?

Myke Hurley: I don't use it as much as I thought because I use mostly modern pens. And I have good pen hygiene as it is. So, I'm never needing the extra that pen flush offers. It does come in handy. I've used it plenty. I just don't use it every time I'm cleaning my pens because my pens are maintained.

Brad Dowdy: It's not like an essential part of your toolkit. I like it. Really? Yeah. Yeah. I get you.

Myke Hurley: Yep. So, in the chat room is mentioning Brian Chewbacca and Ink Dependence are both mentioning a loop. And I do have a loop. I do like looking at the nibs. But I can't really like tell. Like I can tell born by feel if I'm on like a grit pad. But if you're like trying to fix a nib problem, you definitely need a loop to see what you need to work on there. So, that's another good call. And there's some pretty inexpensive loops. You don't need a super fancy one. All right. Zaza the drummer says, Is the Retro 51 refill slightly thicker than a standard Schmidt refill? I started making pens and got really excited because I thought I found a kit that would fit the best ink refill in the world. But it wouldn't fit. So, we need more information here. I think I got caught up in a Twitter chat on this one and found that it was actually the ballpoint refill they were using, not the Schmidt refill. So, Retro 51 does not use a single universal refill. It depends on the pens, right? So, the Tornadoes fit the Retro-branded P8127 refills. The Poppers and the other ballpoints fit the Schmidt Easy Flow 9000 refills, which is a different shape. It's a Parker shape. So, it depends on which refill. You know, you got to decide on which one it is. So, it could be you're just getting them cross-pollinated there on which refill you're actually using because there is no standard Schmidt refill. There's different Schmidt refills for different pens. So, let me know. I think you might have got this question answered on Twitter the other day. So, if not, give me a shout and we'll figure out exactly which one you're using. So, Captain Domestic asks, is there such thing as an inking book? Now that serious coloring books are a thing, how about books with nice paper and non-photo blue pencil drawings? Am I the only one who wants to buy this? Hmm, no. But it's like you and three other people maybe. So, it's not a big market. Like, I think getting the non-photo blue pencil in a book is probably a turn off just for general retail purposes. Like, I think it's very specialty. Like, I would like it. I would enjoy it. I would enjoy taking, like, the inking aspects of finishing off the non-photo blue pencil drawings. And I would enjoy, like, creating my drawing from that base. But I don't think, like, in the grand scheme, like, that would ever be, like, a mainstream thing. Like, we saw coloring happen with colored pencils and colored markers. Not that you can't use those things on this, but I think the hesitancy is you're starting with a page that's not as vibrant or not as direct as the standard coloring books are that we see these days. So, you're going to need a more advanced person to buy this type of thing. And there's probably, like, a teeny market for it, but I don't think it'll ever pop and become, like, a mainstream thing like we saw coloring go. I think it's a cool idea, though. And there might be something out there if you can buy, like, a blue, non-photo blue comic art and draw based on that. So, yeah, I don't know. That's not something I looked at. But I kind of like the idea. I just don't think there's a huge market for it.

Brad Dowdy: I think that makes a lot of sense. Mm-hmm.

Gold Nib Pens

Myke Hurley: So, 7photo, our good friend Rebecca, looking to buy her first pen with a gold nib, under 300 if possible. That's definitely possible. I would like a pretty color. A limited edition would be preferred. I'm looking at Pro Gear Sky, Platinum Nise Lelos, something along those lines, is I would prefer Japanese. What would you pick? You want to answer? Pro Gear. Yeah, I kind of think you got to go that route.

Brad Dowdy: I think if you're going to, if, like, a lot is riding on this, right? No, I mean it. Like, this feels like this is the first, right? It's like the first pen with a gold nib, right? It's a big deal. This is a big purchase. This is a kind of thing that if you screw it up, if you get something that's not perfect, you're going to regret it, right? And I know that Platinum obviously make amazing stuff. They do. They make really great stuff. But you can't beat a Pro Gear. Like, I don't think you can either. And if Pro Gear is in your, like, that is in your site, and you want a special edition, and they have a new one coming out, like, it feels like a no-brainer to me. Mm-hmm.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, and this is one, like, if you don't see right now, you just wait it out, right? You're going to find something that's going to meet every criteria you have. I think you definitely go Pro Gear. Like, as much as I love Platinum's and Platinum's nibs and Platinum's style, I think that you would enjoy, for the lifetime of using the pen, the Pro Gear more. That's kind of, that's the way I'm leaning. I mean, that's a super good question. And we answer this one a lot, and it's always, like, it depends, and, you know, there's lots of caveats, but I think this one's actually pretty clear. Just don't, like, just don't settle on one that you're not completely in love with, because there'll be another one tomorrow that ticks all the boxes, and then jump on that one. So, similarly, Myke, iEric says, I'm considering getting a Pro Gear or a 3776. Shocking. It's good pens. I like very fine nibs. I have a VP vanishing point in both fine and extra fine. Extra fine is too toothy for me, and fine is not quite fine enough. Which would you recommend between the Pro Gear and 3776? This is actually a harder question to answer than the previous question in my book. So, there's a couple of different ways to go. So, you can get a hard fine sailor nib that's finer than their fine nib and a little bit wider than their extra fine nib, but it might be too firm for you. I actually really enjoy Platinum's soft fine nib, which you think would be a wider line than a standard fine because of the softness of the nib and that it, you know, kind of flexes a little bit. But I found the lines I can get from that soft fine platinum nib are finer than, like, my sailor fine lines, and it's still smooth. It was kind of an eye-opener when I got the red Shungyo 3776 with a soft fine nib, and I was converted immediately to that nib. So, I think out of, to answer this question, I would actually go with a soft fine platinum nib to kind of meet the criteria. Yeah, there's a specific. That you're trying to get.

Brad Dowdy: You know, like, these are very specifics, right? Like, if this is solving a problem that Platinum can, oh, sorry, the 3776 can solve.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, and I should know this answer. I don't, does Sailor make soft nibs in their lineup? I know they make hard nibs, and I know they make standard nibs. I don't know that I own a Sailor soft nib. So, that's something I'd be interested in trying if there's one out there. I'll look into that.

Brad Dowdy: Did I tell you, by the way, that my Riello is a hard fine, and I really like it?

Myke Hurley: I think you did, and I think you were, like, surprised that it would actually turn out as well as you thought it would.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, I really like it, which is a big surprise to me, because I didn't think I would really like that at all. But I wanted it because it was fun, but I really like using it a lot.

Myke Hurley: So, I know Pilot does soft nibs, and I haven't tried one of those yet to compare it to the Platinum nibs. But I love, I absolutely love the soft, fine Platinum nibs for someone who writes very fine and small and still wants it smooth. Wonderful nib. So, Gil's Desk, last one this week, it kind of relates to the pen tuning and cleaning stuff. Favorite cloth products for use in pen filling, cleaning, polishing, pampering activities? So, I have two kind of towels I use in my cleaning setup. One is just a basic microfiber towel that I got off Amazon, you know, so you don't have, like, fibers getting stuck in the nibs and, you know, even general, you know, I don't know what you'd call fluff from non-microfiber towels. These are, like, large 12 by 12 inch or so towels. I bought, like, a 20 pack for, like, five or six dollars. They're really good for, like, not scratching up your nibs and not leaving residue. What's the word I'm looking for? I don't know. I'm blanking. You know what I'm talking about. Yeah, just, like, fluff. The little fluffy stuff. Fluff. Yeah. Yeah. So, doesn't leave the fluff around. The second thing I use is actually, and I'll have to find the brand name of them, but it's a shop paper towel. And those are, like, the blue paper towels you'd see, like, say, like an automotive shop. Those are also kind of, they're not fiber free, but they hold up against, like, water very well. They're, like, super durable. They're not going to scratch your pens when you use them to, like, wipe off the nibs or wipe off the barrels. They're really nice, disposable, like a paper towel. It's just made to be real durable, soak up water very well, and not fall apart when you're using, like, a traditional paper towel. So, those are disposable. The microfiber cloths are reusable. So, those are kind of the two cloths I use. I don't ever, I don't have a cloth to, like, polish any fountain pen nibs or anything like that. Although, I did just get this, Anderson Pen sent me this Mont Blanc nib cleaning cloth. Like, it's in the shape of a nib. Like, you, like, tuck it over the nib and clean it. So, I'm going to have to test that out. It's still in the package, so I'll have to try those for just standard nib polishing. But I don't really polish my nibs that much, Myke.

Myke Hurley: Lint. That's the word I'm looking for.

Brad Dowdy: I'm pleased you found it.

Brad Dowdy: Thanks so much for listening to this week's show. You can go to relay.fm slash pen addict slash 306 for our show notes so you can find them in the podcast app that you use. They should be in there all linked up for you. Thanks to Casper and Storyworth for their support of this week's episode. If you want to find Brad online, he's over at penaddict.com, knock.co. He is penaddict on Instagram, dowdyism on Twitter. I am imike, I am yke, and we'll be back next time. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time, say goodbye, Brad Dowdy. Goodbye, Brad Dowdy.