Editing The Pen Addict 369/transcript (section)

== Pen Show Discussion ==


'''Myke Hurley:''' Speaking of pen shows, I'm doing something we've probably sort of discussed, like in very short bursts about pen shows. But I got an email from Kiyomi who wanted to know how to buy their first vintage pen at a pen show. And I hesitated to put this in there because I'm by no means an expert in buying vintage pens and vintage pen markets and vintage pens at all. But that's kind of where a lot of us are coming from.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Or, you know, listen to the Pen Addict podcast or read the blog or things like that. We don't know all these things. And, you know, some of us have learned through experience on how to do it. And we can share that information about what we did, you know, even if it's maybe not the most perfect information ever. It's at least an experience you can take. So I kind of, the way I handled this was I put myself in the mindset of going to buy a vintage pen for the first time at a pen show. So here's Kiyomi's question, then we'll get into the details. It says, you may have covered this in the past since I'm a relatively new listener of a few months. But if you have not, would you consider doing a segment on the must ask questions when purchasing fountain pens from a secondhand seller? So I took this especially like at a pen show, right? It's even harder to buy vintage online. And if you're not extremely experienced, I would almost shy away from it unless, you know, you're up for taking the risk and up for, you know, doing some maintenance and doing some work on your own. If you can do that and you're willing to, you know, put in a little, have a little extra elbow grease, you know, you can get some good deals shopping online. But I've taken this from going to a pen show and trying to find, you know, something you're interested in from a vintage standpoint. So I, and I'm still kind of that way, right? Like I still, I like vintage pens. I like the looks. I like the story. I like the feel. I like the classic nibs, but I'm still not an expert. So I go through these steps. I've kind of done this in the past and I'll do this now if there's something I'm really, really interested in. The first, first tip I have is do as much online research as possible beforehand. Is there a specific brand or model of pen you're looking at? There's online resources. You can search up whatever pen you're looking for and probably find a detailed history of that pen, that pen model, the different styles, the different sizes. Like if you start to look at something like a Parker Vacumatic, you can have one pen color. You think, oh, there's a Parker Vacumatic. But that one pen color, you know, the blue one could have six different sizes and all these different features that change the price dramatically based on how they're, how they're, you know, what size the pen is. So you got to, you have time to, to research before you even show up at a show. Research what qualities make it a good pen. You know, what issues do those types of pen have? You know, what are the gotchas you should be looking for? You know, these pens have been around for 60, 70, 100 years. Sometimes there's information out there, you know, and while you're doing that kind of, you can kind of get a feel for the price. Okay, this pen is in this condition with this nib and, you know, it's around this price. That at least, that's not a hard, fast rule, like price you should take with you and say, well, I saw it online for this. But you start building like this mental database of, you know, pricing and have these general ballparks. You know, what do the most perfect condition models go for? What do, what does, you know, a more used model go for? You know, you can do all of this stuff before you ever set foot in a show. So at least you have a baseline of what you're looking at when you show up. And then when you show up, like I literally, I'll just, I'll walk up to a table. And if the vendor's not busy with another customer, I'll just walk up and say, hey, how are you today? And like kind of, you know, break the ice a little bit. Because if I find something that I want to know more information about, you know, I'll kind of, you know, have started, you know, just like the feeling out process. You know, there's not always a super welcoming party at a vintage pen table, just being honest. But they're few and far between, you know, the kind of the curmiginy types. But you'll know pretty quick, you know, whether someone is like, hey, was open to answering questions and talking to you and, and, you know, give you more information. So I'll just walk up, say, hey, how are you today? And then I'll just start looking. I'll just browse the table, get an idea of what they're selling. Not just what brands they're selling, but what conditions overall the pens are in. You know, you can pick it up by scanning the table if they've just got in a group of secondhand pens from a big estate sale where someone was just hoarding drawers full of pens and they threw them out there on the table. Or you can tell, you know, that there's a lot more care taken in and a bunch of the pens are restored. Like you can kind of tell just in the physical looks of the pens, are they beaten and banged and just kind of being sold as is? Or maybe they've been restored, they look nicer. You know, you can kind of start picking that up on just what the condition is, what the prices are, things like that. So then if I find a pen on that table, I'll ask the vendor, may I pick this one up? Always ask. I don't, I mean, I know some of the vendors and I don't know some of the vendors. Even the ones that I would share a drink with at the bar, like I know them very, very well. I will ask them, may I pick this up? Always. Just do it. Just ask. It makes everyone more comfortable no matter the situation.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' It's a good icebreaker too.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Yeah, absolutely. And then they know what you may be interested in. And then they may just start talking and say, hey, you know, this is a pen from 1967. If they're a good salesperson, they should start talking at that point. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, they'll give you a little bit more information about the pen, you know, talk about did they restore it? Is it restored? You know, is it going to work in like the moment you try to ink it up, things like that. And also, like if you're going to pick up the pen and inspect the nib, which you're probably going to do, if you're not sure, ask, unscrew or pull the cap, you know, should I unscrew it? You know, and they'll just go, oh, just unscrew that one. It'll be fine. So, and be gentle, Myke. Don't spray ink all over their table.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' One time.

'''Myke Hurley:''' If you haven't gotten that initial like feedback, like when you pick up the pen, when you asked the first time and they hadn't started giving you the information, ask them, can you tell me a little bit about this pen? That's my icebreaker. You know, like if I've picked up a pen and I'm kind of interested in it and it's a maybe like, oh, this is somewhat interesting. And I'll ask whoever's behind the table. Can you tell me a little bit about this pen? And hopefully they're going to, hopefully they will, you know, hopefully they'll tell you about the brand and the model and the age and the condition, you know, and, you know, hopefully they'll give you that information. And you know what, if they don't, and if you're getting, you know, not the information you want, you just set the pen back down and say, okay, thank you. And then there's a lot of choices at pen shows. You have options. And if it hasn't come up by this point in the buying process, directly ask if the pen has been restored. If yes, and if they weren't clear about it, ask them if they restored it or if someone else restored it. It doesn't matter, but you just want to know the information. Like if they restored it, they maybe can tell you anymore. Or if someone else restored it, they might say, hey, you know, this guy, you know, over here who does great work restored it for me. You know, you can kind of, it's vintage pen buying is about the information you can collect to be satisfied that you're making, spending your money. Well, you know, you want to leave with a pen in good working condition and ready to write. We're not going in this from a collector's mindset. We're not grabbing, you know, a dozen vintage pens off here to add them to collection. We're looking to find something cool, unique. That's going to be able to be inked up and written with as soon as you leave the show. I'm not in the pen repair business. You're probably not in the pen repair business. We just want our awesome new pen and not have to worry about it breaking down. So ask these questions. Is it, has it been restored? Nine times out of 10, you're going to want to buy a pen that's been restored unless you have some type of experience, you know, fixing any type of vintage pens. We're here to use the pen and write with it. So you want it working. As I mentioned just a second ago, if at any point during any of this conversation, you don't have a good vibe, you're not comfortable. It's totally cool. Set the pen down, say thanks. Go into the next one. You don't have to be in any rush. You know, in the buying your first vintage pen market, there's a lot of options. That's a big market, right? There's a lot of people out there selling great pens at great prices, but you got to shop around a little bit. You know, we're not buying, we, the collective we who listen to this podcast, aren't buying like the single most rare piece found on that table that if you see it and don't immediately purchase, it might not be there the next time you come around. We're in the market to where we have options, right? We can walk around the room, scope out our options, figure out where we can get the best bang for our buck and who is, you know, giving us the most comfort level. You know, when we buy that pen. Anytime I've bought a vintage pen, I've been happy to pay a premium from someone who I know does good restoration work. You may not know this if you're going to your first pen show and trying to buy your first vintage pen on your own, you know, without the resources that I have. And it's kind of hard to get that information. So hopefully during this time you've researched and you're thinking about going to pen show, maybe you've come up with some other friends or some other contacts that might be going to the same pen show like me. If I'm ever there, you know, hit me up, bounce your questions off me, email me beforehand, you know, things like that. And I can tell you, I can look if you're going to, let's just say the Ohio pen show. And cause I know I'm probably not going to that show and it's going to be your first show and you want to buy a vintage pen. You can email me. I'll look at that list and give you, you know, five or 10 people to start with. You know, I can look at the vendors and say your best bets going to be at vendors X, Y, and Z, you know, and that's just general information. It's not, you know, stone cold facts and things like that, but it's just, any little information you can get before you go helps. And if I can point you to like a few people that I've had good luck with buying vintage pens in the past, and I know they're going to be at that show, I'm going to send you there. Absolutely. Every time. So do your research beforehand, ask a lot of questions and don't spend a dime of your money unless you're a hundred percent comfortable. I mean, that's the best information I can give you. I kind of hope this helps. You know, I, I could have just written all this back to Kiyomi and, um, you know, giving them that information. And I kind of thought it was a good question to share. Um, let me put these things down in words. You know, they may not be completely perfect and there's a lot more you can get into than that. So, um, I think that's a good guideline. Those are kind of some of the steps I've taken. Have I missed anything, Myke? Like you haven't bought many vintage pens, which you bought a couple in the past. Is there anything I've kind of missed in like the grand scheme of buying your first vintage pen?

'''Brad Dowdy:''' No, because I would always ask you for advice. I think like, I don't have any advice. I can just commiserate with Kiyomi, right? Like I find it a very intimidating process because I feel like when I go to these tables, I am at a disadvantage. I know less than the person I'm buying from. And if like, I don't really know much about the person I'm buying from, I don't know if they're trying to like suss me out and pull the wool over my eyes.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Right. Right. So it, it's sort of related and, uh, I want to bring it up. I think it was a question we had last episode about why don't vendors price their things. And I don't want to say stay away from them because they might just have great deals and they might just be lazy, but that's generally, I'm going to do more looking than buying. If I can't have that piece of information, right? It's the more information I have, the more comfortable I'm going to be. And I don't want to have to ask how much is this one? How much is this one? How about this one? How much is this one? Cause then you're just driving yourself crazy. You're driving them crazy. So all kinds of things. So yeah, that's, uh, that's good. Ask questions if you can, if you can find like some people to bounce, bounce some questions off to off of, that'd be great too. So that's a little bit harder, but super valuable if you can, if you can do that.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah. And I would say like, you know, as always just make sure you shop around. Like if you, if you talk into a vendor and you don't get a great feeling from them or they don't give you the information that you want, go and see if somebody else has it like, and, and yeah, going to move around the room.

'''Myke Hurley:''' That market's almost, it's that market's just as large as any modern pen market, right? You have options.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Especially if there's a specific type of pen that you want. Like if you want one of the popular pens, like, oh my gosh, if you want a Parker 51, I mean, you can swim in them. So, you know, if you want something that's relatively, you know, if you're going to a place to find something because you want to get a specific pen that is not that rare, then don't buy the first one you see anyway.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Yep. Yep. And then like the 51 is a good example for all the pens that you see, you know, you can see the, what you think is the exact same pen and the price vary by a hundred dollars from vendor to vendor. Your goal should be to figure out why.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Because if they don't have a reason, then you don't want to buy it.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Right. And that's why I said, if I know that the reason why this one's a hundred dollars more is because it's been restored and the nib's been reset and all these things, I'm willing to pay the premium to know for a fact I got something really good instead of getting a deal and having to question it. You say that though, but how do you know for a fact? You don't. I mean, as much as, yeah, maybe a fact is a little bit strong. You have to feel comfortable. You have the best information, decision-making information as possible, you know.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' All right. Today's episode is brought to you as a great little, uh, as a great little lesson from Professor Dowdy, I think. Hope so. I like that actually.

'''Myke Hurley:''' I meant to say, give me some feedback if there's, you know, things that I left out. You know, like I said, I just looked at this as if I'm walking into a show and walking into a table, here's my process. So I'm sure I missed some things. So, um, feel free to let us know. But yes, please tell me about my good friends at Squarespace.