Editing The Pen Addict 94/transcript (section)

== Pen Innovation ==


'''Brad Dowdy:''' So I've been using a phrase that I need to stop using. Because it kind of annoys. I annoy myself when I say it. But I've been saying it for the past few weeks. I caught myself saying it on the last podcast, I think. I've been saying, have pens been solved? Like, has this certain type of pen been solved? Is there any more? Is the answer always the same when someone asks for a recommendation? Or what's a good pen? Or, you know, different things like that. So I got to thinking, are there certain pens that have been solved? You know, what... My frustration is...

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Not so much have pens been solved. But where is the innovation at? As far as gel ink pens and ballpoint pens and rollerball pens. You know, is there... Are there new products coming out that I'm not seeing? Are there new products coming out that aren't new products at all, but repackaged? Are my expectations too high? That I should see all this change? Am I jaded in the state of the general pen industry?

'''Brad Dowdy:''' So, you know, I just wanted to talk about a few different pens and a few different pen categories. And just kind of discuss it with you and kind of get your thoughts too on, you know, what... Are we done innovating with like gel ink pens, for example? Right? I mean, for people who aren't necessarily into the Pen Addict podcast and the blog, I'm kind of not talking about all of us. Right? I'm not necessarily talking about me and you, who are... You know, we know if there's a certain need that we have, we can probably go find it. But I'm more talking about the everyday user, the office user, just, you know, teachers, you know, doctors, whoever. Using pens, going to the store and buying pens. Are they just getting stuck in whatever, you know, marketing that Pilot's throwing out there? Right? For like the Pilot G2. Pilot markets it as America's number one selling gel pen. So, I can't remember a store shelf that didn't have a Pilot G2 on it. And it's been the same Pilot G2 for a decade. I mean, the exact same pen. And so, does Pilot have any incentive to change that? And should I care? You know, am I barking up the wrong tree here, wanting to see Pilot mix things up a little bit and come out with something new? Am I asking for too much? Knowing that I can go somewhere else like a JetPens or any other Japanese importer and get something much cooler and much better than that. I don't know. Am I barking up the wrong tree here, Myke? Am I even, is this even a topic worth discussing? Am I just, or am I just going to end up frustrating myself?

'''Myke Hurley:''' I don't know, man. I feel like it is just a root of frustration. Like, I don't think, to say that something's ever going to be solved, I don't think is correct. Because you never know what's going to come next. And I think we've spoken before about, like I've said this a couple of times, like how I always feel like I find the perfect pen for now, but I don't ever stop looking. Because no pen is, I said this a couple of weeks ago, right? No pen is the perfect pen for me. Right. Because I know that there can always be a better X about it.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Right. And I think that's where my frustration lies. It's number one, yeah, I want to stop saying, have pens been solved? Because I don't think so. And it's kind of a stupid statement. But I find myself saying it over and over again. So I thought if I get it out, maybe I can stop myself from saying it because it's kind of a stupid phrase. But it's frustrating when you go into a store and it's the same thing and it hasn't changed for 10 years. I mean, it really hasn't. I mean, it may be longer.

'''Myke Hurley:''' The way that I see it, though, it's just a totally different market. Yeah. Those pens are sold to different people. Those pens are sold to people that wouldn't buy our pens and our pens are sold to people and we wouldn't buy the pens that are sold to regular people. Right. Does that make sense?

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah. So, I mean, you know, we talk about, you know, what pens are available on the store shelf. And I think that's a totally valid topic. And because I want people who are new to the podcast to at least, you know, think about the pen that they're buying. They can actually make a good decision, even, you know, just go into Staples or OfficeMax. There's some good choices in there. But that never changes, I guess, is what I'm saying. You know, like if I'm sending someone to Staples who hasn't ever tried out a pen, I'm always going to tell them if they want a jelly pen, I'm always going to tell them to try the Uniball Sino 207. That's my favorite jelly pen that they can find from a store shelf. And then that conversation is over. Right. But I don't know. And, you know, maybe that's good for what they're looking for. And, you know, that's all they need and, you know, that they can explore from there to see if they wanted something else or not. But, you know, that answer hasn't changed in years. And I don't know if I'm just being silly. And wanting that answer to change, I guess, is what it boils down to. I don't know. Wanting something new in that gel pen shelf, you know, what can be new. That's why, you know, I get excited over silly pens like the Pilot Juice, which is essentially a G2, but it's got archival ink properties, which the G2, the regular G2 doesn't have. And it's got cool colors, which the regular G2 doesn't have. So, you know, and it's a pen that costs $1.60 or whatever it is. So those kind of things excite me. But then when it doesn't translate to the public, I don't know. I get a little frustrated. But I shouldn't, I guess, is, I don't know. This is like a psychiatry session for me. I'm laying on the couch, Myke.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Yeah, I feel like that's the way. I mean, ideally, though, what do you want? Do you want people to, like the average user, the average person, we talk about this a lot in the technology world, do you want them to be using these sorts of pens? Like, you know, what is, the G2 is really good, you know? Yeah.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' No, I do want them to be using these pens. And I guess my goal would be for them to discover that there's more out there. But that's kind of a pipe dream. And, you know, these things in the stores are kind of the gateway to that. You know, it's better than the generics that they're getting at the office that are just, you know, no-name brands, you know, stepping up to a G2 or a 207 or a Pentel Energel. You know, that's way better than any stock pen you're going to get in an office. And then finding those things. And I think my frustration is that's the end for most people. They're done. We're done. Got my G2. We're good. And that's, like, barely scratching the surface from my perspective. But, I don't know. Like I said, maybe it's just a pipe dream of mine. I need to be the pen ambassador or something. Yeah. I need a TV commercial.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Hi, I'm Brad, and I'm the pen ambassador. Let me tell you about the Pilot Juice.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Do you know what, though? I think part of the problem, if we look at something like the Pilot Juice, is where do a lot of the best pens that we buy come from?

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah, I mean, I know. I mean, they're all Japanese.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Like, companies don't, are potentially not taking a risk on consumers.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Mm-hmm.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Like, maybe people would want to use a, I don't know, Sakura Pigma Micron if they were available in the stores for them to buy.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah, I know, I know. And, you know, it just, I see, I don't know what shows I was watching, but Paper Mate, of all people, has been running this Ink Joy commercial here in the U.S. And I've seen it over the past month on various channels. And I'm like, oh, man, that's such a horrible pen. And all the marketing dollars they're putting behind this pen is just like, oh, you've got to be kidding me with this mess. So, I don't know. But, I mean, ballpoint pens are the prime example. Ballpoint pens are done. I mean, if you're not using the Jetstream or the Acroball, I mean, there's nothing else that can really hold a candle to it. There's good pens. And there's pens that people will enjoy and use every day. They're not as good as the Jetstream or the Acroball. Those hybrid inks are way better than any ballpoint. So, what's the point of even going to the store and looking for a ballpoint pen is kind of my struggle. I don't know. I guess I don't want to say I'm getting, I'm not getting bored with, like, the standard gel rollerball ballpoint pens. But, I don't know. I just want to be able to, I want to be able to see Uniball come out with a new product that I can champion. And that hasn't happened forever.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Does that make sense?

'''Myke Hurley:''' They're just not a brand that you want, that you should be paying any attention to, really. I guess. They don't do what you want.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' I know. I just want it to be, I just want more people to get into this great hobby of ours and find cool stuff like we do. And, you know, get enjoyment out of, like, when we first found, when we discovered, like, the Retro 51. I mean, it really knocked our socks off. I mean, for lots of good reasons. And, I don't know. I want people to be able to discover these things, too. And there's, there's not a lot of opportunities for them to do that. Unless they're as weird as we are in search for pens on the internet, which actually a lot of people still do.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Yeah.