Editing The Pen Addict 313/transcript (section)

== Pen Discussion ==


'''Brad Dowdy:''' I don't even know where to begin discussing this pen. Like, I blocked off a huge chunk in the, in the show notes to discuss this pen because it's going to be a ramble fest. I, I love it. And it's weird. Like I have these, I don't have mixed feelings necessarily on it. I just can't figure it out. Like I love the pen. It's an awesome pen. Obviously it's a Sailor Pro Gear. It's the full size, not the slim, not the king of pen. So it's a full size Pro Gear ocean. So we were always, the first thing that everyone wants to, one has wondered about is the translucency of this barrel. And it is almost identical to the Sailor Pro Gear earth. If you happen to ever run across one of those, I did a review of those, uh, of one of those on the blog last year, a couple of years ago, we'll put a link in the show notes to it. So it's not a completely translucent barrel. There's varying levels of translucency, if you will. So like part of the barrel and part of the cap are really hard to see through. You can tell, like, I can't see the converter in it, if you will. Right. I don't see like the shading or color of the converter, but in the grip section, it's much more see-through. So like the opaqueness level is, I don't know, would that be higher or lower? It'd be lower, I guess. You can see it better. Um, so, and that's not, it's exactly how the earth was. The section was more transparent than the barrel and the cap. But although around the end of the cap, you can see through some of the parts there too. What this pen reminds me of is a color and feel, like the feel of the color of like some, like a 1960s kitchen or 1970s kitchen where they had those really strong, weird colors like the yellows and browns and greens. It feels like it's a, um, you know, what were those dishes called? It feels like it was one of those like very particular dish colors from back in the 60s or 70s. And that's not a knock on it. It's just the way the depth of the color is, is really hard to explain. It's, you absolutely have to see it in person. Dan, I bought mine from the Nib Smith. So Dan Smith did a great job on mine. And for example, if you take the cap off with the cap on the pen, okay, I cannot see the nib inside the pen unless, you know, maybe I stuck it up into the light or something like that. But if I take the cap off and look inside the barrel, it like lightens up and I can see like my finger making a shadow on the outside, if that makes sense. It probably doesn't. No, I know exactly what you're saying.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Really, really hard. I said, no, I think you've explained that perfectly fine. Like, yeah, if there is something inside of a part of it, you can't see it. So like when it's capped, you can't see through the cap. When there's ink in the barrel, you can't see through the barrel. But like you can see through the grip section a little bit and you can see through the cap when you take it off.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' So Tony in the chat room, the green I was looking for is avocado. It's not that color, but it has that consistency, if you will. It's like there's some depth to it. It's a more, it's a teal bluish green. It's real pretty. The ocean color is pretty.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' I like my 1911 tangerine better and I like my sky pen better. So that doesn't mean I don't like this pen. I love this pen. But if you're going to force me to like answer, where does it rank in the colors that sailor sailor has done recently that I also bought and enjoy? I think the tangerine is better and I think the sky is better. But this is such a weird pen. Like I'm having a really challenging time with my thoughts on it. Because I love it and I'm confused by it at the same time. So the thing I like the most about it so far is the nib. So Dan, I ordered a medium fine nib and told Dan to put a stub grind on it, which is, you know, for a really fine nib. That's not the easiest thing to do. And he nailed it. Like my nib is awesome. Dan did a really great job.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Yeah. I don't know. This is such a strange, strange pen. And I'll be talking about this a lot because I find it interesting. The pictures are tough. The thoughts are tough. I love the pen. It's not something I dislike. It's actually quite the opposite. But I don't know how to tell you I like it and why. I'm having a real difficult time on it. But hey, it's a sailor pro gear. The color is awesome. The trim is awesome. The nib is awesome. What else do you need? But if you want me to explain the color, that has been more of a challenge in my mind than I've been able to solve. So related to this pen, I had two questions from the Pen Attic Slack Room. First one from Teante. And I thought this was a good spot to bring up this question. It wasn't about the sailor pro gear ocean, but I think it kind of relates. How much does a pen's cost affect your review and or actual enjoyment of it? Does an expensive pen get a more critical look than a cheaper one? For reference, a sub-discussion came up about the Custom 823 and Stephen Brown's review. The price difference between the U.S. and Europe is more than double. So this is a really good question. We've talked about this a little bit as a kind of a side note when we've talked about reviewer bias before. Right? Like we all have biases, you know, in the way we write and the products we review and the products we choose to review and how we review them and things like that. It's like it's natural to have some bias. And one of the bias points was, well, are you going to be as fair if you spent, are you going to like a pen more because you spent $500 and don't want to feel guilty for buying a $500 pen that you don't like? Then a $50 pen that you don't like, well, you just, you know, slag it off more easily because it was cheaper. Right? So that is a point of bias in just, you know, it's general. Like that's not something anyone does specifically, but that is a thing that can happen. I've never found it to be that way because that's not how I write or review pens. So on a personal level, no. But anyone can say that. It's all, back when we were talking about these bias questions, it's all in the body of work. Right? You learn what a reviewer likes and dislikes. You understand their point of view, where they're coming from and, you know, getting their honest opinions on products. But I do think it can, people do worry about making an expensive mistake, if you will. So, you know, I can see that from time to time, but I don't like, I don't see that necessarily in our community. You know, if I spend that much money and I hate the pen, I'm going to say I hate the pen and I screwed up. And I hope you don't make the same mistake. Or I hope you consider these things, you know, that I found, you know, that I didn't like about this product. And add that to your collection of knowledge about the product. You know, that's the other thing is you never want to take one person's point of view as like the way. Right? I have an opinion. You know, Anna has an opinion. Myke has an opinion. Myke has an opinion. Joe has an opinion. You know, all these people have opinions on the products. And you should take that collective wisdom and apply that to your likes and dislikes. But I do see that as like a little tick in the bias column that a lot of people are maybe less likely to just crush a pen that they've spent so much money on. And it's usually not going to happen anyway because hopefully they would have come to that conclusion before actually spending the money.

'''Myke Hurley:''' I feel like there's also a potential possibility of someone to be harsher on a pen that's more expensive.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Without a doubt. I mean, especially if you're coming from a place where you don't spend. So, if your style and aesthetic is, you know, a $30 to $50 pen, you're going to really, you have a opportunity to feel a certain way about a high price point for whatever reason that you want. You're just like, well, I don't see the value in spending that money on that type of pen, right? Yeah.

'''Myke Hurley:''' I feel like just, at least I feel this way about myself sometimes, that if something's really expensive, I expect a lot from it. Sure. And so, if I don't get that, then I would be mad. And I guess also, you know, if you paid your own money for it as well, there can be some regret in the decision maybe that comes up. And like Tony's just mentioned Visconti, right, in the chat room. And like that's perfect for me where there is one design element that I don't like about those pens. And it makes me so mad. And I won't buy one because they're like $500 or $600. Like where if it was a $100 pen, I would already own probably two of them. Right, right. Right. But like I'm way more critical of pens when they're more expensive.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' But yeah, as we're going to find out in the next question, and I'm not quite done with this first one yet, it's so individually specific. It's hard to like just, you know, completely crush any product that you don't like because it might fit someone else's needs perfectly, right? So, we're going to talk about that in a minute. But I wanted to finish Tianti's question because she was talking about the pricing of the Custom 823.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' And Pilot had a huge issue, I think about two years ago with the EU pricing was crazy. And a bunch of the vendors like really kind of took them to task. And I don't know if it's changed, but it sounded like maybe it hasn't. But so, you know, you want to shop for the best, you know, the best value, the best support. You know, you want to buy from authorized dealers. I do very much believe that. Whether that can support your after purchase questions in a simple and efficient manner and, you know, help you out with anything you need on your purchase. So, you know, that's just kind of a nature of the beast of regional questions. And I know Pilot has had some EU pricing issues in the past and maybe they're not resolved yet.

'''Myke Hurley:''' Well, a lot of companies, they're banking on currency fluctuations in Europe anyway. Right.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' And I think actually Pilot came out. I think they did a press release after that first uproar. I'd have to go back. I may be misspeaking here, but I think they did a press release stating, you know, to that effect, something to that effect. So, all right. So, my good friend Kimberly came in right after Tianté's question and a bit of a follow-up from last week's topic on reselling of pens. She says,

'''Myke Hurley:''' Is that the price that you're paying internationally is very rarely the final price that you'll pay. Because when that pen arrives, you will be hit with taxes. Right. Like, that's one of the reasons that, for example, say that in the UK, that pens are cheaper outside is because they don't have RVAT added to them. Right. Right. Right. But that will get added when it comes through customs. So, like, I think that it is something you've got to remember that sometimes by the time you've paid for shipping, because the shipping will be more expensive, plus the customs, plus the customs handling fees, which you can calculate this stuff. Like, it's possible to do. I think you've really got to weigh it up at that point to work out if it actually is cheaper. I think that is a discussion, like a discussion point that people can get lost in. Well, actually, a lot of the time, you kind of end up about the same amount. Mm-hmm. Right? Like, and it's just something to remember. This isn't always going to be the case, right? Sometimes you might be able to get a deal somewhere or whatever. But I think it's just worth bearing that in mind, that it doesn't necessarily mean cheaper. I always kind of look at it as, like, where is something available? And then plan from there.

'''Brad Dowdy:''' Right. Right. So this is another tough question, because it's so individual per case basis thing. Because you could have two types of sellers. You could have one that's taking advantage of the arbitrage between the price differences, who's trying to sell you a pin and make a profit on it. Or you could have someone who generally, you know, bought this pin, thought they were going to use it, ended up not liking it, and wants to move on from it and buy something else. So, it's almost impossible to answer this question for the variance you get in the pricing. So, like, how can you, you know, get around screwing yourself? You just have to know what the going rate for that pin is and what you think is a good rate for you personally. Like, everyone's going to be, you and I are going to look at a single pin through different lenses. Right? So, I'm going to have a value attached to pin X, and you're going to have a value attached to pin X, and they could be widely varying values, and they could mean something different to both of us. Right? So, you just have to do a little bit of market research, if you will, to figure out, okay, I'm not familiar with this pin. What are the range of prices it goes for? Am I getting a good deal on this pin? Should I pull the trigger? So, it's kind of a little bit of a process-based thing you have to go through. There's no black and white answer to something like this. Right? It's just so many variables, and the biggest one being you as a person. That's the biggest variable. How do you feel about this? Research.

'''Myke Hurley:''' I mean, research is the key. If your concern is that buying used, you might end up paying more, do the research. It's all online for you. You check what you'd be paying, and work out what if you bought it new, what would it cost you in customs and stuff like that. And then, you know, one that I find, and it's up to you how you want to do this, but how much money are you willing to pay to reduce aggravation and increase speed? Right. Right? Like, if your threshold for that is $10, well, that might be the benefit of buying it locally. You know what I mean? You might start tipping scales at that point. So, I think it's a case of, like, if you have a purchase which is big enough for you that you want to really kind of sweat the price, it's all online. You know, all the numbers are online. Just see what it's going for on eBay. See what it's going for in, like, private forums. See what it's going for on you. Work out what the shipping is going to cost you, depending on where it's coming from, and then pull the trigger on whichever one you feel most comfortable with.